[Stumpage]

Well, for me at least, and perhaps others.....

This message is mainly for the Canucks of SBR, especially and obviously for those involved with Scotia Bank...

Today I recieved a phonecall from Scotia Bank in which the Customer Service Head proceeded to inform me that the bank had some concerns with money wires I had initiated to my account from Moneybookers. I've always been careful to space them out, and never withdraw any type of massive amount that might raise a red flag, so I was quite surprised to say the least.

Now, very long story short, suffice to say that this supervisor, after consulting Scotia bank's legal team, had decided that since Moneybookers is affiliated with sportbooks, and that since online gambling in Canada is "Illegal", they would no longer allow me to make money bank wires from Moneybookers.

I patiently tried to inform this woman that actually online gambling is NOT illegal in Canada, be it Provincial or Federal jurisdiction. There is no legislation anywhere to this effect. However, this was futile, as her well thought out reply was simply, "Well, our lawyers say it is....."

So there you go. If you have an account with Scotia Bank, and regularly to semi-regularly make withdrawals to it from Moneybookers (either check or bankwire apparently), be very careful as Scotia bank has decided to bypass government legislation entirely and has declared online gambling to be both illegal, and to quote this supervisor directly, "Immoral".....

[The HG]

Wow that's amazing. I thought Canada was where people went specifically to be able to bank with sportsbooks! Is that not true??

She said "immoral"?? Damn that is funny. I wish I had been on the phone with her, as soon as she said that I would have been like "OOOH! Immoral. That sounds hot when you say it baby. You ever been immoral baby? Ok, forget the moneybookers stuff. When you getting off work? I got some things I'd like to show you."

[Stumpage]

LOL That's classic HG.....Come to think of it, I wish I had thought of something witty and biting to say, but to be honest I was too shocked.

And yes, her exact quote was that "Scotia Bank does not want to condone activity that we deem to be both illegal and immoral" when explaining why I could no longer bankwire from Moneybookers. "We".....Sounded like the Borg collective when she stated it.....

So it's off to one of the other Financial institutions tomorrow, to set up a new account and hope that they do not consider themselves to be an extension of the government, in the strictest legal sense.....

[durito]

That's the right move, take your business elsewhere. I'm positive there are plenty of Canadian banks that will have no problem with you.

[Stumpage]

I agree Durito, and there are.....Still, I hope this was just an isolated incident my one company.....

[Arnold]

People like that get me angry. Why not show everyone where exactly does it say, that it's illegal? What school did that lawyer go to? I mean you're working for a bank, you should be on a much higher level. This proves again that people are under-qualified for their jobs. I see this everywhere, and everytime I'm amazed how frigging retarded these people are.

Well, just switch to another bank. They are losing customers, so it's their loss.

[bigboydan]

Sucks indeed that you have to even go through something like this Stumpage. However at least you have the option of using another bank though and can continue to use MB, unlike us Americans.

[Stumpage]

That's the thing that I ultimately found puzzling.....How could a lawyer, somebody you would imagine is completely up to date on legal issues, be so completely clueless on this issue?

[Stumpage]

Originally Posted by bigboydan

Sucks indeed that you have to even go through something like this Stumpage. However at least you have the option of using another bank though and can continue to use MB, unlike us Americans.

Good point BBD, and I guess I should consider myself lucky. Perhaps Scotia Bank is under the impression that we actually were defeated and annexed in 1812, thus the American government policy.....

[20Four7]

Stumpage: I have had no issues concerning wires with Moneybookers using TD Canada Trust. You may wish to consider them. Mind you I rarely withdrawal and mostly have sent money to Moneybookers.

[fingas]

Stumpage, you can use Neteller in Canada too, right?

[Stumpage]

Originally Posted by 20Four7

Stumpage: I have had no issues concerning wires with Moneybookers using TD Canada Trust. You may wish to consider them. Mind you I rarely withdrawal and mostly have sent money to Moneybookers.

Thanks 20Four7.....I'm actually going to TD today to set up an account, as you are the third person that has suggested them.

[Stumpage]

Originally Posted by fingas

Stumpage, you can use Neteller in Canada too, right?

Fingas, Neteller abandoned the Canadian market last April. That was a real pain, as I use to use them exclusively.....

[fingas]

that is strange why they have done that because i still have phone calls from them and they told me that they are based in Canada, i always need to contact them according Mountain Time schedule

[Stumpage]

Originally Posted by fingas

that is strange why they have done that because i still have phone calls from them and they told me that they are based in Canada, i always need to contact them according Mountain Time schedule

One of their offices in indeed based in Calgary here in Canada, but even so Neteller has banned Canadians. I forget the exact wording, but at the time they made their decision, they cited something along the lines of "Uncertainty regarding the status of online gambling in Canada" or words to that effect.

Obviously somebody working at ScotiaBank must have come across the website and launched their own personal Jihad against the immoral gamblers here, meaning me.....

[indy62]

the wife works in cenral accounting at the scotia bank office i will see if i can find out any info

[Stumpage]

Originally Posted by indy62

the wife works in cenral accounting at the scotia bank office i will see if i can find out any info

Right on.....That'd be great Indy.....I'd be very, very interested to hear Scotia's thoughts on this matter, apart from the Supervisor that I've already talked to.

[Forget_About_It]

I had something similar, TD frozed my accounts and wanted me to come in and have a chat with the branch manager.

At the time I was using Bet365/Pinny, all my deposits from bet365 had to go back onto my Visa when doing withdrawals. After numerous withdrawals from bet365 I had a fairly large credit on my Visa, so I transfered it over in 2-3 chunks over to my account.

About 30 days later all my accounts were frozed, TD Visa then notified the branch and I had to come in and have a chat. The manager then went through my account and questioned the bank wires and asked for reports or proof from the book and which I laughed cause they or I won't do it. Its all because of 911, suspicious bank wires automatically get flagged over 9K or so.

I was honest had nothing to hide and told him it ain't illegal (Which he agreed). I told him I wanted to keep TD as my bank which he agreed too however asked me to open an account at another bank and for these transactions then I can transfer it over to my TD account.

So I opened a Scotiabank account.........shit

They did however cancel my Visa at TD, and 6 months later I left (he wasn't too happy).

[fingas]

Forget_About_It, the bank usually can see which is the person/company that sends you the money.

In your case, the manager should clearly see that the money was coming from bet365 (one of the biggest UK gambling companies that is listed in Footsie stock market). I'm really amazed how stupid can some of these people be.

[Forget_About_It]

I figured that and I even said that, he was just to lazy or wanted me to confirm it.

[OLGC_Slayer]

You need to put in a complaint to the banking ombudsman, your MP and your MPP. If you have a lawyer you may want to see what recourse you have as well.

[OLGC_Slayer]

What about Instadebit?

[Stumpage]

Originally Posted by OLGC_Slayer

What about Instadebit?

I do have Instadebit with my Scotiabank account being registered to it, but I'm under the assumption that this will be treated like a bankwire as well and rejected.

[Forget_About_It]

Thats what I have been using, Scotia has never called about it.

[buztah]

Just read through the thread and JESUS CHRIST this pisses me off, Stumpage! Will the banks decide that my Beer Store purchases are also "'immoral" and ban the Beer Store next? WTF is going on in this world? I'd expect this if we lived in a Muslim state but Jesus this is NORTH AMERICA for Christ's sake! WTF is wrong with these morons?

[Stumpage]

I hear ya, Buztah. Quite frustrating......I might also add that previous to Moneybookers, I had been making regular bankwire deposits into my Scotiabank account via Neteller since 2003, so I fail to understand why it was suddenly a problem. Maybe the Supervisor just wanted to flex her muscles yesterday, who knows.....

[Arnold]

Originally Posted by Stumpage

I hear ya, Buztah. Quite frustrating......I might also add that previous to Moneybookers, I had been making regular bankwire deposits into my Scotiabank account via Neteller since 2003, so I fail to understand why it was suddenly a problem. Maybe the Supervisor just wanted to flex her muscles yesterday, who knows.....

Can be very true. Most likely it is just a bad luck, not the entire bank itself.

[power100]

That is really stupid although isn’t the status of online gambling’s legality in Canada unclear? I would try and speak to a manager before opening an account at another bank. That may just have been the supervisor’s opinion rather than the banks policy especially as other customers have not had a problem with gambling related transactions.

This prohibitionist attitude some western governments are adopting is nonsensical and counterproductive. In the UK online gambling is legal and regulated but UK books have to be licensed and pay their taxes in Britain to be able to advertise here and we have thus seen an increase in books licensed here and increased tax revenues. This is the policy all governments should be adopting as people are going to bet online regardless.

[snakedjp]

This is a little bit scary... unlike in the US, we canadians don't have hundreds of different banks. We only have 5 or 6. And if one of them decides Moneybookers should be banned, then I hope the others don't do the same anytime soon...

By the way, if you're gonna open a new account somewhere, I opened a $USD account at Citibank Canada. At the time I opened it, the wire fees were pretty low, and you can do bank wires online (they're verified by phone later...)

[coldhardfacts]

It's official - Canada's even more effed up than we are.

To contradict Gram Parsons: "Vancouver might be just my kind of town......NOT!!!!!!!!"

[indy62]

Originally Posted by indy62

the wife works in cenral accounting at the scotia bank office i will see if i can find out any info

there does not seem to be any policy about moneybookers.it seems to be a over their head employee not knowing the regs..i havemoneybookers and scotia and im not concerned

[20Four7]

Yesterday while taking the subway, Scotia was announcing that you can WU from any scotia bank. So they are banning moneybookers and encouraging WU? WU has to be one of the most common ways of funding books.

[Scorpion]

Originally Posted by Arnold

Can be very true. Most likely it is just a bad luck, not the entire bank itself.

Maybe his bank wires were much higher than yours!

[Scorpion]

Originally Posted by snakedjp

This is a little bit scary... unlike in the US, we canadians don't have hundreds of different banks. We only have 5 or 6. And if one of them decides Moneybookers should be banned, then I hope the others don't do the same anytime soon...

By the way, if you're gonna open a new account somewhere, I opened a $USD account at Citibank Canada. At the time I opened it, the wire fees were pretty low, and you can do bank wires online (they're verified by phone later...)

5-6 banks PLUS so many more books, do the bank wire from one of the books not moneybookers

[betplom]

I've had business dealings with Scotiabank years ago and the manager of my ScotiaBank branch was definitely nosey & suspicious of my bank wires to California and Hong Kong (buying computer components). He wanted me to keep more money in my account, I told him in a nice way to basically f*ck off I'll do as I please as I'm not getting credit I'm using my own $$.

FWIW, CIBC is much less intrusive and easy to deal with.

I used to use instadebit with my pc financial account, never a problem, moneybookers too.


I'd recommend CIBC or PCFinancial to be used with Moneybookers.

My CIBC Visa card has numerous debits and credits from Bet365, Canbet & Greek on it with zero problems.

to CIBC