[JoshW]

POSTED 10:32 a.m. EST, February 26, 2006



NEW AGENT COMING FOR VINCE?



In the wake of Vince Young's incredibly low score of six on the Wonderlic test, league insiders are predicting that Young soon will fire agent Major Adams -- or, at a minimum, add another more experienced agent to the team.



Adams has very limited experience in the agent business, and none when it comes to managing a guy who's likely to go at the top of round one. As a result, Young wasn't ready for the intelligence test that every incoming NFL player takes.



"The experienced [agents] will jump all over that," said one league source. "The next chapter will be interesting."



Still, the source predicts that Young won't go lower than fifth overall in the draft, despite predictions by other league sources that Young could drop out of the first round. "Teams that are interested will interview him and bring him in to their facilities to spend as much time as they can with him," said the source. "They will find out that he is okay."



Back to the test, there definitely are ways that players can get themselves in position to get their highest scores. Incoming seniors take the test in conjunction with their pro day workout in order to establish a baseline number. Then, they take it again at the combine. We've heard rumors over the years that some agents have access to one or more versions of the test, and many league insiders attribute significant increases in scores from one year to the next to the aggressive efforts of the agent to get the guys ready to take the test.



And even if there's cheating involved, we've heard in the past from management-side sources that it's no big deal. If a guy can memorize multiple versions of the Wonderlic, they've explained, the player will have no trouble figuring out the playbook.



In Young's case, he has only taken it once. At the combine.



Pro Football Weekly has a comprehensive look at last year's Wonderlic scores, which includes a comparison between the combine score and the score generated in the prior year. Some of the low scores included a nine for receiver Chris Henry, a nine for defensive end Eric Moore, a nine for defensive tackle Mike Patterson, a nine for cornerback Lamont Reid, and an eight for cornerback Cedric Williams. The lowest quarterback score was Brock Berlin's 13.



But Berlin more than doubled up on Young.



So that gave us an idea. We printed out the 15 sample questions that we posted on Saturday, and we asked Florio Jr. (who is in the third grade and whose class has yet to delve into the multiplication tables) to sit down and give the thing a try. We gave him five minutes, which admittedly is a slightly greater questions-per-minute average than the NFL types get to answer 50.



Florio Jr. got five of them right.



Five out of 15 for a third-grader. Six out of 50 for a guy who attended multiple years of college, without failing out.



One reader suggested to us that Young's low score suggests that he might have a learning disability. That's fine, but how does a guy with such a disability remain academically eligible at a major institution like the University of Texas?



Stay tuned. This thing raises a ton of questions, and we have a feeling that it eventually will mushroom into a far bigger story than it already is (especially since, you know, we're the only ones talking about it).

http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

found link via homedog at OGD

[isetcap]

All this tells me is that Vince has the most ignorant agent in the business. Obviously this neophyte, Major Adams, did not make Vince aware that a test would be administered since he didn't even know about the test himself. Vince went in, certainly unprepared, and bombed it. I suspect Vincent does not possess the most brilliant mind in humanity but we can't judge based on this simply because he may not have even taken it seriously. When I heard him in interviews, I got the impression he was quite articulate by football standards (he could occasionally form complete sentences with minimal slang usage) and I would be surprised if he does not perform well the next time he takes the test.

[SBR_John]

I think I read Vince's dad is in jail. He grew up in the very tough side of slum and drug invested Houston. To ignorant white elite types they could probably look down their long noses and question his mental capacity. For me he is worth the price of a ticket to see and if he can't do advanced Calculus no problem.

[mad]

No question, brilliant football brain. When you can run and pass like him, who the f@#k cares?

[BuddyBear]

Fellows, that test is not designed to test measure things like calculous or biology...it's designed for a football player who is going to be in the NFL. You shouldn't score that low especially if you go to a university like Texas which is a top tier academic instituation....that's a reflection of the low standards that the Univeristy of Texas has for their athletes and their football programs.

Vince Young should thank God everyday he is a football player otherwise he would be, assuming he is smart enough, flipping burgers everyday for the rest of his life.

[JoshW]

Not unprescedent for a QB from a respected state school to get a 6 I just found out.

Oscar Davenport got a 6 and he went to North Carolina.

Agree with isetcap in part and BuddyBear. If he was prepped better on the test one would think he would have to have done better, but not 100%. A score of a 6 pretty much means you almost gave up or couldn't read. Either way I don't see that as being a positive for a quarterback. If you have 15 minutes and you can't even get more that a couple questions into a test I think that is big trouble either in terms of committment or literacy.

[BuddyBear]

It's simple....an NFL franchise is ready to throw millions of dollars at this guy...they want to make sure he has half a brain. On weekends it seems easy for us fans, but being an NFL QB is not easy. You have to be able to read defenses, adjust, remember a playbook, make audibles, etc...in short, you have to have some intelligence.

If you think oh no big deal he can run or throw the ball...yeah right.

Teams are already nervous about him for a variety of reasons (i.e. doesn't have 4 years under his belt, arm strength, itnelligence, played in a conference that was weak, etc...)

I think this test means something to a lot of people who will be making decisions on Young come draft day.

[bigboydan]

the lowest score ever was a 4 by darrin davis holds that honor. hell, at least sabatian janakowsi got a 9. some harvard grad named pat macenalley had a perfct score.

laker, don't even mention Oscar Davenport to me at all. that guy always came in during mop up duty to burn me everytime on year

[taves]

Steve Young scored a 34, John Elway a 33, Dan Marino a 12. I assume 50 is the highest score, since there are, well, 50 questions. Jason Maas scored a 43, Eli Manning a 39.

http://www.unc.edu/~mirabile/Wonderlic.htm

[pags11]

the guy was an excellent college QB, but his brain will have to do much more at the NFL level...6 is pretty low...

[Willie Bee]

Originally Posted by lakerfan

One reader suggested to us that Young's low score suggests that he might have a learning disability. That's fine, but how does a guy with such a disability remain academically eligible at a major institution like the University of Texas?

Doesn't take a Phi Beta Kappa to figure that out. If a kid can play as well as Young and stay out of trouble, he'll stay eligible. Right or wrong, that's the way it is at any college competing on the Div I level. Lance Berkman, who is no dummy, was once asked what he majored in while playing baseball at Rice. Berkman's answer: "Staying eligible."

I wish this was an issue at just one school, but it's not.

[JoshW]

Feb. 27, 2006, 12:34AM



False score gives Young wrong kind of buzz
UT QB's disputed Wonderlic grade talk of the combine
By JOHN MCCLAIN
Copyright 2006 Houston Chronicle

INDIANAPOLIS - Like his performance in the Rose Bowl, quarterback Vince Young rallied from a huge deficit to pull out a personal victory that might have earned him millions of dollars.

ADVERTISEMENT
On Saturday, a rumor that Young had scored a 6 on the Wonderlic test sent shock waves through the combine. No coach, scout or general manager surveyed could produce an example of a starting quarterback with a single-digit Wonderlic score.

The test — 50 multiple-choice, non-football questions in 12 minutes — is a barometer that teams use to gauge a prospect's ability to learn.

On Sunday, the combine said the test score of 6 that was being reported by some media outlets was false.

"I've been told it was inaccurate by a source good enough for me to quote it," Texans general manager Charley Casserly said Sunday afternoon.


Young took the test again and scored 16. According to Young's agent, Major Adams, the Sunday test was administered by Jeff Foster, executive director of National Scouting Combine.

"The combine officials assured us that score (6) was false and that the accurate score will be known when the combine results are given to each team," Adams said.

Wonderlic scores are supposed to be confidential and are never confirmed publicly by the NFL. Because they are included in combine results given to teams after the combine, scores leak out.

"The number really doesn't mean anything to us because we go through a process of four or five other ways to evaluate it," Casserly said. "The number's insignificant to us in the end. It's the other areas that we put more weight on."

Prospects can take the Wonderlic tests as many times as they want.

"I heard about the 6," Tennessee general manager Floyd Reese said Sunday morning. "I heard the test was improperly given, and I heard they're going to try and correct it.

"It could be improperly given because of time. It could be improperly given because when you correct it, there are like six or seven different tests. If you correct Test A with a correct sheet for Test C, it's not going to come out very well."


Rose-tinted glasses
Many executives believe the Wonderlic test is culturally biased, which is the reason they administer other tests they believe more accurately test a player's intelligence.

"I've seen players test in single digits and play 10 years, and I've seen some guys test in the 30s that couldn't walk across the street," said Reese, who has been in the NFL since 1975.

Before the combine, many prospects get help to prepare for the test. They take the tests almost every day to get ready for the combine. Young is expected to take the test again before the Longhorns' pro day March 22.

Scores for quarterbacks in the past five drafts vary, according to nfldraftscout.com. For instance, Michael Vick scored a 20, David Carr had a 24 and Eli Manning came in with a 39.

"The Wonderlic is just a red flag," Titans coach Jeff Fisher said. "Before the draft, everybody will sit down with Vince and find out if he can process information. The test has been the standard for decades, but it's only one part of the evaluation process. It's just a first step. There'll be a lot of other tests he'll undergo."

Sean Jones, a member of Oakland's personnel department, put little stock in Young's Wonderlic score.

"All I need to know about Vince Young is that he came up with one of the greatest performances ever in the Rose Bowl," Jones said. "In the fourth quarter, I saw (USC coach) Pete Carroll throw every kind of blitz at Vince. I saw Vince read the blitz and beat the blitz.

"I don't care what his Wonderlic score is. The only score I care about is 41-38."

Defensive tackle Rodrique Wright, Young's teammate at UT, came to the QB's defense.

"I think Vince's decision-making will be missed even more than his athleticism," Wright said about the Longhorns. "We knew all along that Vince was a great athlete who could run and throw, but the biggest improvement he made from his freshman year through his junior year was in the decision-making process.

"You don't lead a team to a national championship if you can't make good decisions."


Interview goes well
While Young's Wonderlic tests created a huge controversy, he was busy interviewing with different teams, including the Texans.

"I thought the interview went well," Young said. "I thought coach (Gary) Kubiak was cool.

"They asked me a lot of questions about offense. At the end, they asked me why I thought I'd be good for the team. I basically told them that I'm a high-character guy that wants to win. I said it's important to be a leader.

"I told them I wanted a chance to lead them to a Super Bowl win."

Kubiak was impressed with Young, too.

"We had a great interview with him," Kubiak said. "I wanted him to tell me why football's important to him. I wanted to talk to him about his leadership qualities. We talked a lot about offense.

"I was very, very impressed with the kid. But I was impressed with Reggie Bush, too."

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3687374.html

[SBR_John]

Marino scored a 12? WTF?

Lets face it, most these guys are PE majors and may pick up a tough basket weaving class but otherwise its a cake walk.

[BuddyBear]

Originally Posted by SBR_John

Marino scored a 12? WTF?

Lets face it, most these guys are PE majors and may pick up a tough basket weaving class but otherwise its a cake walk.

Not sure about that john....most athletes have real majors...i had quite a few students who were on the football team...some who even got drafted....and most weren't terribly bright but they took all the tough courses too. They all have tutors too which makes this more suprising.

I think the real critique should come against the NCAA for allowing this to happen and losing sight of the fact that these players are first and foremost students coming to get an education...not becoming professional athletes.

[SBR_John]

Well you of all folks would know.

I've never had a big problem with these student atheltes skating by. Although I do have a problem with allowing them to graduate. There is now a report that Young's test results were reported wrong so I guess we'll see.

As I said earlier, its easy to sit back and judge. But a lot of these kids come from generations of pure poverty. They did not go to white folk schools and sat in air conditioned and heated schools with good teachers and new text books. I wonder how many folks here know, really know what its like? I say give these kids a chance.