End of "The Surge?" End of McCain?

ritehook · 03-28-2008, 07:29 PM

With the Mahdi army again shooting up the streets, and engaging the Iraqi govt, the so-called Surge is in danger of collapse. If US troops get involved, it will collapse.

McCain has made the supposed success of the the Surge a key point in his campaign.

ritehook · 03-28-2008, 07:33 PM

The fighting in and around Basra seems very much like the wars between rival factions of the Mafia.

Basra is the oil export center of the country. Since the Brits washed their hands of it, it has been controlled by Shia street gangs, the militias. Smuggling of oil and other commodities is a huge billion bucks biz there.

The govt wants to control it. Sort of like the Sicilian maria going after the Irish mafia.

And US soldiers may die for this conflict of greedy interests.

durito · 03-28-2008, 07:36 PM

It was always a bit of a myth that the surge was all that successful. Yes the numbers showed it too be, but it was successful because they convinced certain groups to stop fighting, not because they inserted a few extra US soldiers in the area.

How many more billions can we spend?

Cee · 03-28-2008, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by durito

It was always a bit of a myth that the surge was all that successful. Yes the numbers showed it too be, but it was successful because they convinced certain groups to stop fighting, not because they inserted a few extra US soldiers in the area.

How many more billions can we spend?

The US convinced these certain groups to "stop" fighting b/c the US sends em money

AgainstAllOdds · 03-28-2008, 07:40 PM

If mccain says he will withdrawl throops and end the war, he would be the next president...

daggerkobe · 03-28-2008, 07:48 PM

i would never vote for him anyways. not only is he a racist but wants to ban betting on college sports.

ritehook · 03-28-2008, 07:49 PM

What durito and cee stated.

The Surge was to a certain extent a public relations ploy to help the GoP nominee.

It rested on 3 fundamentals: (1) That the Mahdi army army of El Sadr would stay quiet, keep the unspoken truce. That's now history,

(2) The fact that "ethnic cleansing" has been bloodily successful in Iraq, in separating Shia and Sunni. That alone sidelined much of the violence,no one in the neighborhood left to kill

(Before Bush invaded Iraq was a near secular state, with very little religious bias. Shia and Sunni intermarried, women wore Western dress and had high prorfessional positions, and a
Christian was the second or third most important man in the Iraq govt. You won't see that again.)

(3) The so-called Sunni Awakening was bought and paid for by US taxpayers. Each of the roughly 80,000 Sunni fighters who turned agains AlQuieda are paid $300 a month.

But they want the central govt out of their towns, and the govt doesn't trust the Sunni to organize life in their own aress. Very fragile situation.

Back to the wars that I prefer, by young athletes on the basketball courts.

ritehook · 03-28-2008, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AgainstAllOdds

If mccain says he will withdrawl throops and end the war, he would be the next president...

Probably true, as both the lady and the black guy wll meet silent resistance among a sizable block of voiters.

But McCain is now locked into the Surge. What may happen here is that Bush and Co could blame it all on Iran, get us into another war, and tout John as the guy to win it.

OLGC_Slayer · 03-28-2008, 07:55 PM

Should have never been there in the first place.

ritehook · 03-28-2008, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OLGC_Slayer

Should have never been there in the first place.

Put me in the "Amen Corner" on that one.

Scorpion · 03-28-2008, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by durito

It was always a bit of a myth that the surge was all that successful. Yes the numbers showed it too be, but it was successful because they convinced certain groups to stop fighting, not because they inserted a few extra US soldiers in the area.

How many more billions can we spend?

They were paying the insurgents $300 per month

Cee · 03-28-2008, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scorpion

They were paying the insurgents $300 per month

instead of using our tax dollars to fix the economy we pay gangsters

purecarnagge · 03-29-2008, 11:23 AM

300 a month is like 30,000 over there... 15,000 is like 250,000 US.

ShamsWoof10 · 03-29-2008, 12:46 PM

We need wars... We need them for many reasons but depopulation and global restructuring are probably the two most important reasons....

Today the United States is a major piece to the global puzzle but IMO 10 years from now the United States will simply be... just another piece...

IMO if you don't like war then DON'T GO! I am very tired of hearing how "FREE" the United States is.... VERY TIRED OF IT!!! If you don't agree with something then don't contribute to it...

Helmut · 03-29-2008, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShamsWoof10

We need wars... We need them for many reasons but depopulation and global restructuring are probably the two most important reasons....

Today the United States is a major piece to the global puzzle but IMO 10 years from now the United States will simply be... just another piece...

IMO if you don't like war then DON'T GO! I am very tired of hearing how "FREE" the United States is.... VERY TIRED OF IT!!! If you don't agree with something then don't contribute to it...

I thinking about with holding my tax dollars, that will show them!

ShamsWoof10 · 03-29-2008, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helmut

I thinking about with holding my tax dollars, that will show them!

You ain't showing no one sh*t... They can print those...

They do every night..