[raiders72002]

TOW

Take it FWIW - Spoke to Lenny (Betcascade) last night I've known Lenny for years. Saying we've had a "troubled" relationship all along would probably be an understatement... nevertheless we always maintained an open line of communication.

He approached me last night. While talking I asked him on his thoughts about the threatened lawsuit the place across the street is orchestrating on behalf of owed players.

"There are no assets...at least none I can get my hands on anyways" Lenny said, confirming my initial feelings about the chances (less then slim) of a legal action.

"If there were assets they would have been sold to pay customers," Lenny added.

I'm sure owed players will be slightly upset when I say this but I'm reasonably inclined to believe Lenny would have paid them if he had access to funds.

At this point of the conversation I challenged him by saying that I advised some players to write off their Betcascade balance (which, by the way, is the truth).

"Everyone will be paid," Lenny maintains. "Some have been paid."

This statement clashes with what has been reported across the street, according to which negotiations for a payment plan have failed.

"Do you really think John has access to my info? He can see my books? He is a liar." Lenny said.

Not that he had kind words for me either.... "You started doing your thing over again," Lenny said about our reports, downgrades and warnings on BetCascade. "Just pure poison." He categorizes them.

Despite the tone of the conversation I am inclined to believe he will try to come clean. My challenge to him is to initiate resolving matters with some customers who can actually confirm this. If and when this will happen hope will be replaced by faith and faith will reward what can be seen as the struggle of a man cought up in a series of misfortunate events (happens to everyone in life but only the honest ones come clean).

As always..time will tell.

TOW
http://www.towforum.com/online-sport...ast-night.html
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[kdmfox]

[tblues2005]

dkmfox,

Your right who cares...

[BigBollocks]

I think there are people with 5 and 6 figure balances being held captive at Cascade that might be inclined to care just a wee bit, but what do I know?

This is an absolute fiasco, and there has certainly been misinformation put out the entire way. However, when Lenny comes right out and says John is "a liar" and hasn't told the right story I think it's very curious to see how John will respond.

Sorry if you guys are bored and would rather talk about entertainment news or something, but those of us who are in tuned with the industry are very interested (which was what this forum was originally for)...

[kdmfox]

I think there are people with 5 and 6 figure balances being held captive at Cascade that might be inclined to care just a wee bit, but what do I know?

This is an absolute fiasco, and there has certainly been misinformation put out the entire way. However, when Lenny comes right out and says John is "a liar" and hasn't told the right story I think it's very curious to see how John will respond.

Sorry if you guys are bored and would rather talk about entertainment news or something, but those of us who are in tuned with the industry are very interested (which was what this forum was originally for)...

I think it's fact that Lenny has screwed many out of tens of thousands of dollars ... I don't think many of those care about Lenny calling John a liar or what the correct story is ... All they care about is their $$$$ ... Who said what and when is just a sideshow.

My advice to John is don't dignify this with a response to a thief.

[HedgeHog]

K-Fox: Agree with everything you said except "all they care about is their money". For the vics, and I am one, it is more than the money. This once top Book needs to answer for its crimes and Lenny belongs in jail.

[katstale]

Let's get real here. Lenny calling someone a liar is like Al Sharpton calling someone a racist.

It's like........

You get it!

[m3vr6]

is this the same betcascade?

http://www.YES, THAT WAS THE CORRECT LINK.com/

[kdmfox]

K-Fox: Agree with everything you said except "all they care about is their money". For the vics, and I am one, it is more than the money. This once top Book needs to answer for its crimes and Lenny belongs in jail.

You're right HH ... If I was a victim I'd want Lenny in jail and my $$$ ... Back to the point of this thread which is Lenny calling John a liar ... Pretty funny when a thief who stole his customers money calls someone a liar and he wants the story set straight, like that's the issue ... The right story isn't getting you any closer to your cash.

[jjgold]

Johnny and I do not like each other but he is no liar, he actually is very honest with the players here.

[Bill Dozer]

There are a lot of silly things in the couple paragraphs but the posters above are correct. There is nothing worthy of discussion.

[d2bets]

OK so on the one hand Lanny says "there are no assets"

And on other hand he says "everyone will be paid".

[cincy_1]

TOW and Lenny ... people we can trust ... but only with someone else's money.

Richcoastsports says it all ...

[BigBollocks]

I think it's fact that Lenny has screwed many out of tens of thousands of dollars ... I don't think many of those care about Lenny calling John a liar or what the correct story is ... All they care about is their $$$$ ... Who said what and when is just a sideshow.

My advice to John is don't dignify this with a response to a thief.

You're right on the money KDM, and I think that's a good suggestion for John to not even give that scumbag the time of day in terms of the namecalling. I'd put the odds of those players getting paid at around 50 to 1, and would probably only buy those players' owed money at around $1 for every $200 owed. Sad situation which only continues to get worse...

[HedgeHog]

BB;

Sold! I'm owed $11,645.45, so you can buy my interest at 1/200 for $58.23. PM me for where to send the check.

[BigBollocks]

BB;

Sold! I'm owed $11,645.45, so you can buy my interest at 1/200 for $58.23. PM me for where to send the check.

I'm real sorry to hear that HedgeHog. Words can't even describe how low Lenny is. After reading that Lenny won't even pay 4 cents on the dollar to those asking for it, I can see why you and another PM I just had are willing to take anything. No more PMs please guys, it looks like the true odds on this are 0.00%...

[HedgeHog]

Exactly, and I was just kidding about the settlement--I know there is no chance of seeing a dime.

[pokerking]

Lenny is a compulsive lier. I've had many conversations with him on messenger proving all his lies and he still denies everything.

[louis]

Lenny is upset at SBR, because SBR quickly uncovered two additional sportsbooks using the same IP address, and using the same database as Cascade. SBR has also given his Cascade book a rating of F. The whole thing is really kind of sad, because for a long time Cascade was a reputable book and Lenny and his management paid everyone. When WWTS decided to fold, Bodog stepped up to the plate and bought them out, at least partly to keep up the health of the industry. I wonder why noone has moved in to buy Cascade.

[jjgold]

Looks over whelming here that no ones believes Lenny

[SBR_John]

Lenny says SBRJohn is a liar according too TOW

Two outstanding and upstanding guys.

[HedgeHog]

This reminds of logic problems on college aptitude tests:

L always lies
L says J is a liar

Conclusion: J is not a liar

[Breaker]

I wonder why noone has moved in to buy Cascade.

I know of at least one place that offered to, but Lenny wouldn't do it.

The amount of unlucky fools still depositing must be substantial enough to keep going...

[SBR_John]

Breaker is correct. Lenny has been approached. He is not selling. Lenny has found that running a deposit-only sportsbook is very profitable and takes less employees too. He is going to run this scam until they lock him up or deport him.

[pokerking]

Have the payment processors been notified about Lenny's scam? He needs to be cutoff from them.

[suzysuzy]

Breaker is correct. Lenny has been approached. He is not selling. Lenny has found that running a deposit-only sportsbook is very profitable and takes less employees too. He is going to run this scam until they lock him up or deport him.

oh my god, that makes me even sicker than i already was.

[suzysuzy]

i called lenny to ask him why he didnt sell, (dont ask me why i bother) he says i need to stop believing everything i read and get my head out of the clouds cuz no one has offered. i guess that's not a surprise.

[katstale]

It's kinda like Hillary Clinton calling someone a skank ho lezbo.

It's like......

[atakdog]

People keep talking about how he belongs in jail. What surprises me is that he has stolen so much from so many, yet he is still walking. Heck, if it were my money I'm not sure where to put the o/u on how long he'd keep breathing. Why hasn't anybody handled this in a direct fashion?

C'mon, gamblers of the world: get some collective spine, and take care of this before even more people get robbed.

[SBR_John]

We have seen this before. Once they get the taste for stiffing they won't even try to make a good faith payment. We tried to convince him to pay just 1/600 of what he owes a week and he would have none of it.

Meanwhile he is taking deposits and figuring out how to open sportsbooks under the SBR radar.

[kdmfox]

John ... Any estimate on the amount this "deposit only" clown gets a week?

[BigBollocks]

John ... Any estimate on the amount this "deposit only" clown gets a week?

KDM I don't know how that mother****er looks himself in the mirror. And the fact that he can lie straight into the faces of the people he's ****ing while opening up even more scam books in an attempt to defraud even more people is despicable. I'm with atakdog, if that man owed me a significant amount street justice might damn well resolve the situation....

[BigBollocks]

SBR I'm sure it's allready been asked, but how could you have ever trusted someone so low? There were a good handful of people who never trusted Lenny from the beginning. Also, why was BetCascade still allowed to be in the "Ds" until several weeks into this football season? Lenny is absolute slime...

[jjgold]

I guess he did not stiff the wrong guy yet, it will happen eventually

[SBR_John]

BB we knew the guy for years. Over many years you start to trust people. In the early years we always had Lenny as a C+ guy. In the last 3 or 4 we really thought he matured. He always worked hard and did not fit the profile of a scammer.

Kdm, not much but probably a couple of thousand a week off the new scams. He has a good credit business. He is probably making between 12k - 25k a week between the deposit only scams and dealing straight with his agent business.