[The Genius]

Would it be possible to start a group of significant players who bet, move lines at 1 book then to bet back at another book?
Anyone interested?

[Justin7]

It's already done. You cant' do it in the big sports (the moves won't cover the buy back), but it can happen in smaller sports - especially if the bookmakers aren't familiar with the specific values of certain half-points.

If you're serious about this, you need at least 200k in capital (you're usually risking juice for a low-odds middle).

[Arilou]

I actually think it CAN be done in major sports, but you'd need that much more capitol and access to a wide array of books. In general, this is likely possible but far harder than it probably looks to you right now.

[ShamsWoof10]

FAAAAAAAAAR HARDER because you are not the only money in.. Other bettors, middlers, or scalpers with big money can come in and either balance your bet or go the other way..

[The Genius]

Don't know if that much ca$h is required.
I am led to believe that lines are moved at some books when certain players make a bet.
Could a group of 10 players here communicate a bet on 1 line per day, make it move and bet back when your % profit kicks in?

[degenerate#1]

What'd you do, read a book from the 90's?

[The Genius]

What'd you do, read a book from the 90's?

lol
Just thinking that now US players out of bookies, we may have moved back to the 90's!

[Lucas]

Don't know if that much ca$h is required.
I am led to believe that lines are moved at some books when certain players make a bet.
Could a group of 10 players here communicate a bet on 1 line per day, make it move and bet back when your % profit kicks in?

It really is not so easy: like Shams said, there are many others plus if bookie is not idiot, then he will not allow 10 maxbets without moving a line, therefore the second, third... pool bettor gets worse prize. If all the bettors bet at one moment at bookie who allow such a bet, you will be in trouble VERY QUICKLY.

[degenerate#1]

You are better off finding teams/pitchers where people will bet up then bet them early then sell off once it's bet up. It helps a lot with books like Matchbook.

[ShamsWoof10]

You are better off finding teams/pitchers where people will bet up then bet them early then sell off once it's bet up. It helps a lot with books like Matchbook.

Agreed!!!

[ShamsWoof10]

he will not allow 10 maxbets without moving a line, therefore the second, third... pool bettor gets worse prize.

VERY CORRECT!! I forgot to mention this good point Lucas..

[20Four7]

It really is not so easy: like Shams said, there are many others plus if bookie is not idiot, then he will not allow 10 maxbets without moving a line, therefore the second, third... pool bettor gets worse prize. If all the bettors bet at one moment at bookie who allow such a bet, you will be in trouble VERY QUICKLY.

I made 3 max bets yesterday at pinnacle

1st bet +133
2nd bet +128
3rd bet +125

The line will move. This wasn't a major sport and the max bet was small but at pinny the line will move. I bet the max on a prop for basketball earlier and the line move was incredible.

[Dark Horse]

If you can find one or more books that will take the action, I would look to move the NFL opening line on Sunday night, and only bet spreads that were either 3 or 7, or a half point from those numbers.

By betting that early you may be in it for the longer haul, because instead of irritating the book you give them information that they consider valuable. Just a thought.

Smaller sports may be better, but NFL should have higher limits. Too many details to work out and too risky for my taste.

[degenerate#1]

I made 3 max bets yesterday at pinnacle

1st bet +133
2nd bet +128
3rd bet +125

The line will move. This wasn't a major sport and the max bet was small but at pinny the line will move. I bet the max on a prop for basketball earlier and the line move was incredible.

Obviously if the max bet is 500 or 1000 a 1000 wager will move the line. Try moving the line for MLB and report back sir.

[vanzack]

Obviously if the max bet is 500 or 1000 a 1000 wager will move the line. Try moving the line for MLB and report back sir.

Bingo.

To move the line a penny at Pinnacle on an NFL game would take 30K.

And then someone takes the other side and moves it right back.

[Lucas]

if this can be done then definetelly not at pinny!
this is how it works at minor leagues, props, etc:
for simplicity let we consider that nobody have bet the event and line is -105/-105, adter you max one side line should move to -114/+104, then -123/+113, so you never get an arb in this way, you simply need someones else money!

yes, at some events line can be moved maybe more if they say true: by sharps, but sharps that they spot are usually different kind of bettors than arbers

also when the market is more "saturated", i mean when some people bet both sides in the past, max bet will not move it as much as you move openers

i see only way here, to hit openers with red circles, when maxbet is significantly lower and then hedge when red circles dissapear or change to blue, but without knowledge of the sport it is nonsense, because you can probably make nice valuebets on the other side and there are many people waiting for it as was sad, so they can steal "your" odds and you can go to work to McDonald - but this is only theory and i will not try to test it at pinnacle with my money

[raiders72002]

Use to do it all the time in Arena Football. Max bets, buying back while selling points setting up a scalp with a middle.

10 different guys doing it from a forum would never work. You can't trust forum guys and some wouldn't be able to buy back because of the line changes.

[Actionbrett]

Bingo.

To move the line a penny at Pinnacle on an NFL game would take 30K.

And then someone takes the other side and moves it right back.

If thats the case then how much money, in your opinion, was spent on Atlanta -1 to get this reaction, and how should I read something like this hapening?

10/8/2006 7:34:44 PM Atlanta Falcons -3 109
10/8/2006 7:33:23 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-121
10/8/2006 7:32:43 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-115
10/8/2006 7:32:22 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-111
10/8/2006 7:32:02 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-108
10/8/2006 7:31:22 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-104

NFL Football, two point LM within the three minutes its been on the market at Pinnacle.

[Lucas]

If thats the case then how much money, in your opinion, was spent on Atlanta -1 to get this reaction, and how should I read something like this hapening?

10/8/2006 7:34:44 PM Atlanta Falcons -3 109
10/8/2006 7:33:23 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-121
10/8/2006 7:32:43 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-115
10/8/2006 7:32:22 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-111
10/8/2006 7:32:02 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-108
10/8/2006 7:31:22 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-104

NFL Football, two point LM within the three minutes its been on the market at Pinnacle.

who knows!
it could be also some on air move, it is hard to say now

right now i maxed opener at pinnacle WNBA allstar OVER 180 -105 and line is only -110

[Lucas]

OMG what an idiot i am... pinny has me probably in sharp case... line moved to 182 and i have middle with plus points... well actually it is hard to say, obviously they pay attention to WHO is betting

[jjgold]

never would work with posters because 7 out of every 10 are thiefs and compulsive gamblers, on paper it looks good but in reality you will get destroyed and burned.

Very few groups make it and most go broke

[Actionbrett]

I agree with Gold, I wouldnt mind getting somone elses response on my above example with a 2 point line movement in a few minutes..

[degenerate#1]

I agree with Gold, I wouldnt mind getting somone elses response on my above example with a 2 point line movement in a few minutes..

Who knows. Your looking at one game almost a year ago. Maybe there was something on Vick status, maybe your looking at the early line and they had low limits that day. Maybe Pinny was just adjusting their numbers.

But from what I seen, it's mostly juice that moves when you get a bet down. There's probably some extraneous information that is not available now. But if you are assuming just on that one example you think you have the power to move the line at Pinny, BOL to you.

[tacomax]

I agree with Gold, I wouldnt mind getting somone elses response on my above example with a 2 point line movement in a few minutes..

I was once sold a stone which I was told would keep me safe from bear attacks. I've had that stone in my pocket for 3 years and I've never been attacked by a bear.

That means that the stone prevents bear attacks.

[jjgold]

You would have to be out of your mnd to bet big money in unregulated contries, only place that is safe to bet big money if they take the bests is Vegas.

[Justin7]

If thats the case then how much money, in your opinion, was spent on Atlanta -1 to get this reaction, and how should I read something like this hapening?

10/8/2006 7:34:44 PM Atlanta Falcons -3 109
10/8/2006 7:33:23 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-121
10/8/2006 7:32:43 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-115
10/8/2006 7:32:22 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-111
10/8/2006 7:32:02 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-108
10/8/2006 7:31:22 PM Atlanta Falcons -1-104

NFL Football, two point LM within the three minutes its been on the market at Pinnacle.

You made bets on Sunday evening, when opening limits are lowest. What were limits, 1k? The first 4 moves were "automove", and the last one was a manual adjustment.

[vanzack]

I agree with Gold, I wouldnt mind getting somone elses response on my above example with a 2 point line movement in a few minutes..

Could have been an injury, could have been an adjustment to other books, I didnt check the date but it could have been early in the week, lots of things.

I can tell you for a FACT that on a saturday or sunday on a strong line they dont budge, even for big money.

[vanzack]

You made bets on Sunday evening, when opening limits are lowest. What were limits, 1k? The first 4 moves were "automove", and the last one was a manual adjustment.

Didnt see this but if it was on a sunday night, what explanation are you looking for? Lines are volatile when they first come out and its not always because of money coming in.