[imgv94]

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/...n2528226.shtml

Are we headed for ruin?

[ShamsWoof10]

Not yet.... There is still time before the roofs goes... The Dow is at an all time high with other markets soaring and I hear so much bearishness... Talk about fade....

[imgv94]

This guy is the top accountant in the country..

I'm hoping for the best, but this is some scary Shit.

[LGBoots]

Sounds bad but here in the UK we are in an even worse state

1,House prices wildly out of control (Average price is $380,000 based on current exchange rates). when they crash (Which will probably be very soon) it will be a much harder crash then you guys stateside are currently going through(IMO)

2, Current government deficit is worse then the US when you take into account that the US population is 5 times bigger then the UK.

3, CC debt is higher here then the US.

4, Pension funds collapsing leaving many poor sods with nothing .


Uk will soon become a 'basket case' only good thing is that they at least let us gamble tax free

[Mark Shark]

I think it is the same everywhere. Here in Australia I am just waiting for the good times to come crashing back to earth.

Yes and we can gamble tax free here as well...

[jjgold]

Guy is setting himself up to run for an election, what a phony.

Cry woldf and say what people want to here, this is all a set up

He might be right with his numbers but he has other motivated, what a phony.

[jjgold]

Of course everyones has an agenda, thjis guy is a fraud.

[BrentCrude]

I didn't hit the earlier link in this thread but I'm assuming the guy you talked about that said we are heading for financial ruin is USA government comptroller Walker who was featured on 60 Minutes a few months back.

It all stems back to Roosevelt ''the bad one FDR, not Teddy''when he opened the floodgates of Keynesian-socialist economics with his ponzy scheme short term quick fix solutions to spur economic growth.He was the first to implement such hogwash as to pay farmers not to grow crops and to burn and destroy food-commodities while people were hungry.He started what is called the planned economy and he was no friend of free market capitalism.He despised gold because he couldn't control people having an independent source of wealth that the government couldn't tax and watch over.His idea of an economy was to tax,spend,keep creating a steadily more available and worthless currency and have everyone work in some capacity for government.I live in an area where there are countless absolutely worthless projects that FDR funded that put people to work in makework jobs.OK,today we are supposed to be good stewards of the land by being environmentalists so we are spending more tax dollars refurbishing swamps and wetlands.Well,to spend money and create makework putting people to work in public works FDR spent tons of money to fill in the same swamps.So the economic way of thinking in this country since FDR has been to dig a hole and fill that same hole back up.

Take a good look at everyone you know and your neighbors.How many in some capacity work for the government or collect some government entitlement check that they never really put much money into.I look at my neighbors and it's all social security,medicare,medicaid,SSI disability,pill programs they pay $40 a month into and receive $500 in pills they don't even need,frivalous lawsuit awards,working directly for the government in a job that shouldn't exist and the beat goes on and on and on.Who are the fools that help keep the system afloat?I know entire factories that closed because the company went bankrupt and with it the pensions disolved.So the government's pension guarantee corporation moves in and pays the majority of the employees pension.This fund dried up so fast it would make your head spin and the employees who collect the pensions who never contributed much have the balls to whine that the pension was cut to 80% of it's original agreement.When Bush signed the senior pill bill 2 years ago seniors who buy $500 in pills a month would have to pay $45 a month to receive them and they were whining that it was too confusing and complicated to understand.So much for them being the greatest generation who were tough people who had to live through a depression and a war that was nothing more than a world bankers war.FDR then goes on after WW2 to support Russia and building up everything in Europe with the USA tax dollars Marshall Plan and then we were left to fight the cold war against FDR's ally that bankrupted us even today.

It's the private sector employees and small business owners who get the beejesus kicked out of them with taxes and regulations.Then they wonder why jobs are shipped overseas.It's because we are no longer competive.The government even has to resort to shrinking the value of our dollar which is becoming worthless just so we can sell stuff abroad at a cheaper rate.

Another barometer of how we have become a socialist nation is that the government-tax payer now sponsors state run industry.It's called corportism and that involves giving sports team owners like Steinbrenner 900 million to build a new stadium while he's paying Clemens 28 mill to pitch in a few games.I think the US government -tax payer is giving Steinbrenner some of the money through some bogus 9-11 reparation fund.The Washington Nationals stadium will be paid for with the nations tax dollars.I call them the Washington National Socialists.Look at how the government paid off 9-11 victims families 2 mill each.They don't do it for anyone else who gets killed by an illegal allien or foreign born thug let in this country to go psycho on people and kill them.

Do you ever read engagements in the newspaper?Most people getting married work in non productive government makework jobs.You see things like diversity councilors in academia,public relations for the womens advocasy awareness program,grief councilor for dwarfs on disability,penis envy councilors,etc,etc.Then you have the medical industry that's 80% too big because when we became uncompetive as a country where we couldn't produce goods we had to find a new makework industry to fill the void.The government created 10's of millions of hypochondriacs so we produced an engorged medical industry out of thin air.

Look at academia.50% of the air brains going to college are just taking worthless fluff courses where the only job they can get is some made up job like youth councilor grief advocate in the sexual harrassment department at the recreation center.


The perpetual motion machine mentality of running an economy will wind down soon and things will burst.We really are in a depression now already and don't know it.It's sort of like the frog being slow boiled in a pot and not knowing he's being cooked.I compare our economy to this.I lifted a styro double quarter pound cheeseburger container in ** Donalds parking lot and it was vibrating.I just had to open it and entombed in the box were 20 thousand magots who were running out of food and who were eating themselves.When we took on Keynesian economics where we discouraged private sector production of goods and replaced it with everyone working a phoney government job we as a country became the entombed styro container of magots.We are running a perpetual motion machine of economics where we unplugged ourselves from private sector free market capitalism and we think the machine can run on it's own by having everyone employed in some fashion by the government.The social service lady will go to the sexuall harrassment councilor and the sexuall harrassment councilor will go back to college getting her masters in sexuall harrassment giving the professor in that field more work and the professor will be too busy teaching this crap long hours that her kids will be neglected and turn to drugs and need drug councilling and be good customers for the court system.You get the drift.You just created an economy out of thin air that we have today.

If you are in your 40's or younger don't count on the pyramid scheme entitlement programs you were forced to pay into all your life to be around for you when you are 62 like they are now.Think positively like a good worker bee and just say that it's good everyone is being taken care of on your dime and it's not a bad thing to have to work till your 80 knowing it's all for the good of the people.

[BrentCrude]

I didn't hit the earlier link in this thread but I'm assuming the guy you talked about that said we are heading for financial ruin is USA government comptroller Walker who was featured on 60 Minutes a few months back.

It all stems back to Roosevelt ''the bad one FDR, not Teddy''when he opened the floodgates of Keynesian-socialist economics with his ponzy scheme short term quick fix solutions to spur economic growth.He was the first to implement such hogwash as to pay farmers not to grow crops and to burn and destroy food-commodities while people were hungry.He started what is called the planned economy and he was no friend of free market capitalism.He despised gold because he couldn't control people having an independent source of wealth that the government couldn't tax and watch over.His idea of an economy was to tax,spend,keep creating a steadily more available and worthless currency and have everyone work in some capacity for government.I live in an area where there are countless absolutely worthless projects that FDR funded that put people to work in makework jobs.OK,today we are supposed to be good stewards of the land by being environmentalists so we are spending more tax dollars refurbishing swamps and wetlands.Well,to spend money and create makework putting people to work in public works FDR spent tons of money to fill in the same swamps.So the economic way of thinking in this country since FDR has been to dig a hole and fill that same hole back up.

Take a good look at everyone you know and your neighbors.How many in some capacity work for the government or collect some government entitlement check that they never really put much money into.I look at my neighbors and it's all social security,medicare,medicaid,SSI disability,pill programs they pay $40 a month into and receive $500 in pills they don't even need,frivalous lawsuit awards,working directly for the government in a job that shouldn't exist and the beat goes on and on and on.Who are the fools that help keep the system afloat?I know entire factories that closed because the company went bankrupt and with it the pensions disolved.So the government's pension guarantee corporation moves in and pays the majority of the employees pension.This fund dried up so fast it would make your head spin and the employees who collect the pensions who never contributed much have the balls to whine that the pension was cut to 80% of it's original agreement.When Bush signed the senior pill bill 2 years ago seniors who buy $500 in pills a month would have to pay $45 a month to receive them and they were whining that it was too confusing and complicated to understand.So much for them being the greatest generation who were tough people who had to live through a depression and a war that was nothing more than a world bankers war.FDR then goes on after WW2 to support Russia and building up everything in Europe with the USA tax dollars Marshall Plan and then we were left to fight the cold war against FDR's ally that bankrupted us even today.

It's the private sector employees and small business owners who get the beejesus kicked out of them with taxes and regulations.Then they wonder why jobs are shipped overseas.It's because we are no longer competive.The government even has to resort to shrinking the value of our dollar which is becoming worthless just so we can sell stuff abroad at a cheaper rate.

Another barometer of how we have become a socialist nation is that the government-tax payer now sponsors state run industry.It's called corportism and that involves giving sports team owners like Steinbrenner 900 million to build a new stadium while he's paying Clemens 28 mill to pitch in a few games.I think the US government -tax payer is giving Steinbrenner some of the money through some bogus 9-11 reparation fund.The Washington Nationals stadium will be paid for with the nations tax dollars.I call them the Washington National Socialists.Look at how the government paid off 9-11 victims families 2 mill each.They don't do it for anyone else who gets killed by an illegal allien or foreign born thug let in this country to go psycho on people and kill them.

Do you ever read engagements in the newspaper?Most people getting married work in non productive government makework jobs.You see things like diversity councilors in academia,public relations for the womens advocasy awareness program,grief councilor for dwarfs on disability,penis envy councilors,etc,etc.Then you have the medical industry that's 80% too big because when we became uncompetive as a country where we couldn't produce goods we had to find a new makework industry to fill the void.The government created 10's of millions of hypochondriacs so we produced an engorged medical industry out of thin air.

Look at academia.50% of the air brains going to college are just taking worthless fluff courses where the only job they can get is some made up job like youth councilor grief advocate in the sexual harrassment department at the recreation center.


The perpetual motion machine mentality of running an economy will wind down soon and things will burst.We really are in a depression now already and don't know it.It's sort of like the frog being slow boiled in a pot and not knowing he's being cooked.I compare our economy to this.I lifted a styro double quarter pound cheeseburger container in ** Donalds parking lot and it was vibrating.I just had to open it and entombed in the box were 20 thousand magots who were running out of food and who were eating themselves.When we took on Keynesian economics where we discouraged private sector production of goods and replaced it with everyone working a phoney government job we as a country became the entombed styro container of magots.We are running a perpetual motion machine of economics where we unplugged ourselves from private sector free market capitalism and we think the machine can run on it's own by having everyone employed in some fashion by the government.The social service lady will go to the sexuall harrassment councilor and the sexuall harrassment councilor will go back to college getting her masters in sexuall harrassment giving the professor in that field more work and the professor will be too busy teaching this crap long hours that her kids will be neglected and turn to drugs and need drug councilling and be good customers for the court system.You get the drift.You just created an economy out of thin air that we have today.

[Seattle Slew]

Pure nonsense. If the war bills from the past 4 years haven't ruined the US, nothing will. The economy always goes through a recession every 10 years of so. This guy loses all credibility with this line:

"You know the American people, I tell you, they are absolutely starved for two things: the truth, and leadership," Walker says.

Really? With the 2000 and 2004 election results?

[jjgold]

Guy is a phony, I wonder how much he has made on insider trading tips?

[Dark Horse]

Stop thinking US economy and start thinking global economy.

If you keep your feelers out and stay on top of important developments, you can always make money. Compare to anti-gambling legislation. Lot of panic, a few victims, but for players who paid attention it's business as usual.

And just in case the economy does a 1929, get yourself a good survivor knife.

[isetcap]

Ahhh, the wonderful side effects of entitlement programs. This is a perfect example of why a capitalist economy should automatically discard anything that falls under the category of "entitlement".

[ShamsWoof10]

Stop thinking US economy and start thinking global economy.

Not trying to jock DHorse but this is the best post made period end of story... In short the US Economy is deflating there is no question about it but it's been and will continue to be very gradual... This guy is not only right but it's been happening it's just not going to explode like a bomb overnight... In Berea where the Browns workout there are 21K people... There are 400 homes up for sale with 100 in foreclosure.. Delphi is jumping on the wagon and have cut workers pay 40% across the board... Jobs that have left are NEVER coming back and it's planned to happen this way... Things have been happening for the last 5 years (job losses 300% increase in energy in some cases ((gas)) and now downturn in housing) We are going to wake up one day and compare what was to what is and wonder what the hell happened...

Imagine all the economies as buildings... The US has the highest building and the plan is to make all the buildings relatively the same size so the US building has to get cut to prop some others up....

By the way it's important to watch what happens in the UK but generally what happens there will happen in the US... I.E. HOUSING!!!

[ShamsWoof10]

I don't buy the "sky is falling" theories. The people who invent these theories are the same ones building underground bunkers.

I am not attacking anyone on this thread; this is general statement about what I believe.

Hey Patrick what's up... I understand where you are coming from but you must understand for the people that are losing their homes and/or jobs (record numbers every quarter) and taking 40% pay cuts THE SKY HAS FELL not is falling... This has continued to happen over the last five years with the pace picking up... All I am saying is when you get nickle and dimed (in referance to the economy) eventually you won't have much... My cousin who is or should I say WAS an engineer at US STEEL lost his job... That's 75K a year gone and he told me I was a nut when I told him in 03' to plan...

I created a list that year called "THE PIE LIST" and I put people's name's on it who didn't think jobs were going anywhere and housing was peaches and cream... My cousin was on it and I SHOULD mail him a picture of a pie with his face in it but of course there is no need for that....

[pico]

Stop thinking US economy and start thinking global economy.

If you keep your feelers out and stay on top of important developments, you can always make money. Compare to anti-gambling legislation. Lot of panic, a few victims, but for players who paid attention it's business as usual.

And just in case the economy does a 1929, get yourself a good survivor knife.

hard to stop thinking about the US economy. pretty much everyhting else in the world are tied to the US eocnomy. if shit happens in the US, FTSE, DAX, HangSeng etc. will all collapse. and vice versa. remmeber a month ago when shanghai stock dropped because chinese gov is putting on the clamp on investment fevor? Dow dropped 450 point the next day. i mean you can diversify your risk by putting your asset into different curriencies, different markets etc. but once the US economy collapse, the rest of the world won't last that much longer. for the 1929 depression, german mark went to shit and so was the european economy.

BrentCrude's rant on keynsian economics has some truth to it, but it worked at the time. By digging a big hole and fill it up later does help the economy in a weird way...because giving people things to do is better than tell them to stay home and handing out dole. a best example i can think of is the rossetta stone. when napolean army way in egypt, his soldiers were bored out of their mind, so they caused all kind of trouble. so napolean ordered them to dig...what were they digging for...nothing...it was just to keep them busy so they won't cause more trouble. keysian economics works the same way, by creating worthless job do decrease unemployement, and people feel better knowing their friends and family are doing things rather than staying home unemployed. an idle mind is the devil's playground, and an idle hand leads to masterbation (i think i've heard this somewhere).

Is keysian economic a sociolist ponzi scheme? i am not sure. i am not sure what was the reason we went off the gold standard, but there was much less bank runs (pretty much unheard of nowdays) after we went off the gold standard...so maybe by trusting a piece of paper with gov approval does help stablizing the economy. however, the US is more in debt than before. someone says it is bad, someone says it is good. how many successful business men have you met who is completely debt free? even billionaires leverage their assets to fund projects, so hard to say whether the US economy is heading to ruin because they spent too much.

If you believe my point about digging a hole and fill it up helps the economy then it is pretty obvious all these "useless" social service posts are essential to the economy also. you can argue, we don't need homosexual depression awareness consulars or we don't need affirmative action quota managers, but it does help to stabilize the economy and it does make us (at appeared to be) more civilized. if we only keep the essential jobs, then we might end up with few job opening like, farmer, hunter, breeder (aka town whore), gunsmith etc.

finally, i don't think the US economy is in trouble and i don't think the US gov can simply weaken the dollar because the us gov think we need to boost our exports. I think the value of the dollar is a result of current account balance all over the world, the strength of US economy, and the current demand. Have you all noticed that Thai Baht has increased its value lately? do you also know the Thai gov has pretty strict rules on inward foreign remittance. so part of the reason the baht is more valuable right now is there is more demand. The US dollar is pretty much the "gold standard" for other curriences. There are still some countries that have their curriences pegged to the USD. So you don't have to worry about the US eocnomy until major developing countries has more reserve in Euros than USD. until then, you should just relax, smoke a bud and enjoy the home run derby.

[pico]

Well Steel as an industry has taken a beating in this country; we cannot compete with foreign competitors. However, there is a serious need for doctors, nurses, software engineers, professional engineers, architects, degreed accountants...

If Americans weren't too busy dumbing themselves down with American Idol and Myspace, most of us would be in a better position financially...

i don't think american are dumb. foreigners appear to be smart because we kept the stupid ones out. even the ones try to get here on a boat, the dumb ones will probably die on the way here. just live in another country for a year or two, you'll realize american are geniuses compare to that general population.

[ShamsWoof10]

Well Steel as an industry has taken a beating in this country; we cannot compete with foreign competitors. However, there is a serious need for doctors, nurses, software engineers, professional engineers, architects, degreed accountants...

If Americans weren't too busy dumbing themselves down with American Idol and Myspace, most of us would be in a better position financially...

Remember though that they are the real auto makers... They make hoods and other parts for them... GM/FORD etc. just assembles them more then anything so business is down and they are downsizing even more not to mention also moving jobs out..

You are right about Doctors etc. to a point but everybody can't do those because we would have even more saturation not to mention that they would be in a bad situation to if the people they take care of can't pay them....

I DEFINATELY AGREE with the Americans and myspace comment but everyone already knows that...

[ShamsWoof10]

remmeber a month ago when shanghai stock dropped because chinese gov is putting on the clamp on investment fevor? Dow dropped 450 point the next day.

I want to make sure I know what I am reading before I comment on this... Are you speaking of late Feb. when the Dow dropped after the Chineese markets had reportedly fallen..?

[ShamsWoof10]

In 5 years, 100,000 Lockheed Martin employees will RETIRE at the same time. We need more educated and SKILLED workers in this country.

Automation...

[vanman]

Sounds bad but here in the UK we are in an even worse state

1,House prices wildly out of control (Average price is $380,000 based on current exchange rates). when they crash (Which will probably be very soon) it will be a much harder crash then you guys stateside are currently going through(IMO)

2, Current government deficit is worse then the US when you take into account that the US population is 5 times bigger then the UK.

3, CC debt is higher here then the US.

4, Pension funds collapsing leaving many poor sods with nothing .


Uk will soon become a 'basket case' only good thing is that they at least let us gamble tax free

House prices will not crash in the UK as demand far out ways what is available.

[vanman]

it sure is.

[ShamsWoof10]

House prices will not crash in the UK as demand far out ways what is available.

Demand does not mean they have the money to pay for it... My dad told me one time that people need a place to live so it won't crash.... I told him people need to eat too and if I am hungry with no money can I walk into a store and just grab a bite to eat..?

The value of something is only as good as the willingness and ABILITY to pay for it... If they really do have worse cc debt then the US well then....

[vanman]

Demand does not mean they have the money to pay for it... My dad told me one time that people need a place to live so it won't crash.... I told him people need to eat too and if I am hungry with no money can I walk into a store and just grab a bite to eat..?

The value of something is only as good as the willingness and ABILITY to pay for it... If they really do have worse cc debt then the US well then....

the only reason interest rates are rising over here is due to cc debt,all that will happen is people will stop splashing out with cc,tighten belts for a while,house prices will level out not crash,then this time next year when interest rates start to come down people will start spending again.

[ShamsWoof10]

the only reason interest rates are rising over here is due to cc debt,

I believe this to be very incorrect as I believe the reason why rates are rising is due to the 10 yr. If it is the case then it will continue rising even if the feds pause as they have the last year...

[vanman]

I don`t know but there`s a guy at work who looks like he`s stolen his teeth from a horse.

[imgv94]

What goes up must come down...

Right?