[Dark Horse]

Why was Cascade downgraded to B+?

[Dark Horse]

A little surprised. This book seemed on its way to the straight A's. No bad feedback on this board. Meanwhile Nine is getting blasted, but is A. Nine is now better than Cascade?

[pags11]

when was it downgraded dark horse?...

[pags11]

I see just recently...Bill, care to comment on the reason for the downgrade?...

[rara51]

slow paying large neteller payouts possibly?

[BadAzz]

Me not being able to find anyone from live chat in last 1,5 months despite constantly trying?

[Santo]

Somebody must be having a joke to rate Nine above Cascade.

[SBR_John]

There are some issues on the credit side and Neteller has had a dry spell. We talked about Nine in the Nine thread. But for those who missed it Nine is owned by VIP which has just relocated Nine from Costa Rica to Curacao. As we said in the Nine thread, they need to put the move behind them asap.

[beetman]

Cascade has been having server problems for well over a month, it seems. It's fairly common that I can get to their main page but I can't log in to place a bet.

But of course the idea of rating VIP or Nine above Cascade is laughable.

[Dark Horse]

C'mon SBR. Don't start losing your edge.

A book dropped from the A list. That's pretty big these days, or at least it is to me; especially when I have money in the joint.

I always liked it that you kept us up to date on important changes in the industry. That way we can make our own judgement about continuing to play at a book or not.

Very strange to have this hush-hush approach towards Cascade 's drop from the list of best books, and to sweep Nine's transgressions under the carpet because 'they moved'.

You just went from A+ to A in my book.

[sergfro]

$$$$$ talks

[Yoshi]

They are sold too much on the VIP grp, obviously.
But hey, nobody is perfect, and compared to those other sites SBR is the bomb. I hope they dont forget wwts thou.
Sometimes the posters know a bit too.

Back to topic, the downgrade for Cascade doesnt surprise me.
But it would only be fair to downgrade certain other books too than...

[Dark Horse]

SBR is still the best. Hands down.

My main request, especially after what happened with WWTS, is that a downgrade of an A-book is clearly explained, either on the main page or on this forum. Some of us may keep certain amounts in A-book and other amounts in B-books.

[jjgold]

VIP Group much safer than Cascade, there is ZERO comparison

[acw]

There are some issues on the credit side

Are you referring to some player being owed a 6 figure amount for some time now?
In all honesty even a B is too high for any book that cannot pay all its customers at any given time.

[pags11]

anyone with anymore info. on the reason for the downgrade?...

[SBR_John]

acw,
As you know, credit issues can get complicated. We won't be discussing credit issues on the forum. There are usually two sides to every story assuming there even is a story here.

[acw]

acw,
As you know, credit issues can get complicated. We won't be discussing credit issues on the forum.

So next time you will still go for a minor downgrade?

Anyhow how have the Greek issues been going?

[BigBollocks]

Anyone still questioning the downgrade or SBR's information a few months ago?

If anything I think SBR is often TOO CAUTIOUS before downgrading books. When it comes to my money I want to know if potential trouble lurks ahead as fast as humanly possible...

[SBR_John]

I agree with you BB.

I have asked that our entire handeling of the Cascade rating downgrades be reviewed for critical breakdowns.

Questons I have include;
Cascade was a paying sponsor on SBRLines during this downgrade period(at some point, we pulled them down and issued a refund). Did that play any part in what appears in hindsight to be cautious downgrades? The biz side of SBR is run sperate from the ratings side. They are in different locations for a reason.

What information did we have and from what sources and when?

We had been to Lenny's place many times and he had visited SBR many times. Did a professional freindship get in the way?

Real people make these ratings. No one expects perfection. But we will review what happened here to see if errors were made and make sure they are not repeated.

[katstale]

John, it doesn't bother me that you have a friendship with Lenny--in fact I am sure most of us are hoping that friendship will lead to accurate updates and some, if not all, people getting paid. It is a fine line you walk between vouching for a professional friend and becoming a shill. I have thought you guys have been pretty even handed during all of this mess with Cascade. I hope Lenny shows you guys a little love for stickin up for him as long as you have!

[BigBollocks]

SBRJohn---it's precisely that kind of introspection and desire for continuous improvement that SBR sets for itself that leaves you simply without an equal. You raise several terrific questions, and any solid MBA program will tell you that it is the ability to formulate the right internal questions that leads to a higher standard of performance. From a corporate standpoint you run an extremely well run operation. I only wish this site and forum could get out to even more punters who could desperately use your services....