[fearless]

Using that bank account to deposit and withdraw funds to and from your internet wagering accounts? The US can't tell other country's banks what to do... or can they?

[Dizzy]

Hi everyone

I am glad that you brought this up rainbow as I was just about to create a thread to discuss the same thing.

I don’t live in the USA. Im living in Ireland but I really think that the way that the government over there is abusing your freedom of choice is disgraceful. Also the way in which they are doing it (in the name of security) just adds insult to injury. I am hoping that such measures will never make it to this side of the water, however I have been looking at possible options encase a similar situation should occur here.

The best solution that I have seen so far is the age old Swiss bank account. There is a site here containing all of the information that you need.

http://swiss-bank-accounts.com/e/index.html

There are a range of different account types and sizes for holding various amounts of funds. They can also be opened by mail and some allow international bank transfers. They also have a strict privacy policy which can only be lifted as part of a drugs or firearms investigation. They do not regard tax evasion as a series crime and would not disclose account information with a foreign government in such matters.

Would it be possible for U.S players to open an account by mail? Then fund their gaming accounts using their Swiss bank account? Most of the Swiss accounts are fully accessible online, so there shouldn’t be too much of a problem.

Please note that this is just a suggestion and I have not had enough time to research it properly. Anyone who is considering using this option should read through the information carefully themselves before making a decision. Whichever route that you guys take I hope that it works out for you, I really do.

NOBODY should be able to make a decision on whether or not you can wager on sports except YOU.

Good Luck
Dizzy

[fearless]

Thank you, Dizzy. That's crucial information that you shared. I don't know why no one else is replying.

[Concorde]

Dizzy beat me

http://forum.therx.com/showthread.php?t=410433

[Bradster19]

I've been doing A LOT of research on the foreign bank account idea in the last 24 hours. That link belongs to a Swiss company (Micheloud & Cie). They kind of act as a middle man for people all over the world interested in opening Swiss bank accounts. They charge a pretty hefty fee (something like $700+ US depending on the account type). It seems like a great idea in theory, and in my opinion a small price to pay to know your money is safe and that Bob Goodlatte will never see any of it. I have email inquiries to this swiss company and to Neteller asking if the Swiss bank account I get from their website will be compatible with a Neteller account. I'll post their replies if you guys are interested...

[Dizzy]

Thank you, Dizzy. That's crucial information that you shared. I don't know why no one else is replying.

Thanks Rainbowworld.

I’m not sure if there are laws in the U.S that forbid Swiss accounts. I know that here in Europe, everyone from criminals to judges and even politicians have them.

The privacy laws regarding Swiss banking are so tight that they make this possible. Here is another link with some more information.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_banking

I know that if the law in my country changes for the worse for gamblers. This will be a solution that I will have to look at.

The way that I see it is that, you guys over there work hard for a living and then pay tax on your earnings. Whatever you have left after that, it should be your choice to wager it on sports or not.

[fearless]

A much cheaper solution may be opening a bank account in Canada or Mexico. Or how about this: have someone send you money to your neteller account (just pay them back immediately). Take that money and deposit in the internet gambling site, deposit problem solved. Withdrawing may be more difficult, I'm not sure if withdrawing money to US banks is illegal now (it probably isn't a good idea anyway because big brother will be watching).

[Concorde]

If a certain point is reached, books will come out with their "own" "swiss" bank ( i am sure Pinnacle and co. already have a plan A, plan B ready ... ), you will simply open an account with that bank/s ( in the same simple way like the one up and spending nothing ) so Mr Frist and company are ****** ( unless they create a new law that don't allow USA citizens to have bank accounts outside the USA!!! ).

[fearless]

unless they create a new law that don't allow USA citizens to have bank accounts outside the USA!!!

That would be going WAY too far, that would impede trade worldwide. Until the US finally becomes a third world country... and then no one would give a shit. lol

[Dizzy]

If a certain point is reached, books will come out with their "own" "swiss" bank ( i am sure Pinnacle and co. already have a plan A, plan B ready ... ), you will simply open an account with that bank/s ( in the same simple way like the one up and spending nothing ) so Mr Frist and company are ****** ( unless they create a new law that don't allow USA citizens to have bank accounts outside the USA!!! ).

If it was possible for the books to set up a bank, i'm not sure if the U.S government would allow U.S banks to deal with them.

The Swiss option may be a little expensive, but it is a one off fee and could be a small price to pay for the freedom it would bring.

[Concorde]

If it was possible for the books to set up a bank, i'm not sure if the U.S government would allow U.S banks to deal with them.

The Swiss option may be a little expensive, but it is a one off fee and could be a small price to pay for the freedom it would bring.

They don't necessarely have to set up a bank, they can use the "Bank of Louxembourg" ... can a Nation prevent a citizen to send money to his Bank of Luxembourg's account?

[Dizzy]

They don't necessarely have to set up a bank, they can use the "Bank of Louxembourg" ... can a Nation prevent a citizen to send money to his Bank of Luxembourg's account?

Im not sure. There is talk of U.S citizens not being allowed use Moneybookers or Neteller to fund their betting accounts.....so why not overseas banks.

If thousands of people start to exploit loopholes in the system, it will be really interesting to see just how far the U.S gov will go to prevent them.

I guess only time will tell.

[psycho44]

people sending money to foreign banks 1) would evade taxes 2) decrease the domestic currency supply and as a result domestic currency goes up and inflation growth rate decreases accellerating a recessionary economy.

I know 2 people that have Swiss accounts. One is Paul Martin, former Prime Minister of Canada, that has a shipping company somewhere around Costa Rica and hides is funds in a Swiss Account to avoid tax evasion and the is Saddam Hussein, former Iraqi President.

Now if both of them were to take money out and bring it into the country, of course they will be taxed, but the trick is to find a way to get it into the country legally. Like set up dummy companies or something. I"m not too familar with money laundering but I'm sure any lawyer can help you out on this issue.

[wpet99]

Surely you can set-up and offshore account or an account in Mexico or Canada, after that you wire your funds to your offshore account then load your sportsbook from there ?

[pags11]

you guys figure out what we'll have to do and keep me updated...

[jjgold]

lol...........most bettors bet under $25 a game and are not going to go through all this trouble, face reality its over for most of us.

[pags11]

way to stay positive JJ...

[durito]

nm

[SBR_John]

Remember all offshore bank accounts must be reported to the IRS if the balance ever reaches $10k during the year.

As far as I know, you must appear in person to open an offshore account. If you are taking a vacation out of the country it could be a good idea. Dont open an account in Mexico, the peso has gone down 1,000% in 30 years. Any of the islands like Curacao or Nemis or the BVI all have stable banks that have been operating for 80+ years. That would be my suggestion.

[jjgold]

You do not have to appear in person to open an offshore bank account and one of the best is called Provident Bank in Belize. I had an account there but withdrew everything and closed it out because wire transfrers were about $75 a pop.

http://www.providentbelize.com/main/index.html

You will need lots of ID and of course a usa bank statement notorized by the bank on the banks leterhead.

[Lucas]

I am afraid Swiss is partly integrated into EU, so the avoiding taxes can be a problem. It is not WWII. I think there are some better countries esp. for Europeans.

[acw]

If you are an American I strongly suggest that you try to find some non-American "friends" that will open accounts for you and take care of all the funding, etc.

[SBR_John]

You do not have to appear in person to open an offshore bank account and one of the best is called Provident Bank in Belize. I had an account there but withdrew everything and closed it out because wire transfrers were about $75 a pop.

http://www.providentbelize.com/main/index.html

You will need lots of ID and of course a usa bank statement notorized by the bank on the banks leterhead.

Good call JJ. I tried to open a securities account there and had all kinds of problems. Finally, I was told they shut down that end of their business.

If you guys open an account here or any offshore bank remember this: the service is horrible at all of them. The fees are extremely high as well.

[twotall]

Do the banks you guys are talking about have ATM cards. If it really came down to it couldn't you withdrawl your money with an ATM card.

[SBR_John]

Yep, all have ATM cards and even Mastercards.

[tblues2005]

Yep, all have ATM cards and even Mastercards.

SBRJohn,

Do you think the sportsbooks in the nations will set you an account there at some bank there in their country? What are you hearing on what they are planning on doing to get around this? I think they have several options like person to person transfer with Neteller, **, or **********. I think they will have plenty of time since it might take up to a year for everything to get everything set up from the government and I am sure they will have to hire more people to montior and say hey this should be blocked. I just think it is a large mountain to climb to enforce this. Plus there is plenty of people here really upset at what they are doing on this anyway, it has showed in the lastest polls that the Democrats are looking good now since this has happened to poker players. I heard the poker players alliance has about 2 million members and it is climbing rapidly and be rest assured that they are discussing things right now with Democrats and then the Democrats are going to support them on this. I certainly believe that the law will be changed expecially if a Democrat gets voted in office next presidential election and then there will be regulation on this passed, possilbly making it legal for certain countries maybe to operate online casinos and make it legal for Amercian companies also, so the WTO will be happy also. I just think that this isn't going to work very easily for the government to control, so the next step is to make it legal sometime down the line. Keep me up to date there SBRJohn on whats happening with it, I am sure that books are smart and they will find a way around it and the ones that just say no to Americans are probably the ones that weren't very good either or had terrible ratings of paying people back. I am positive that they have plans "B" out there just in case of this. I haven't received anything as of yet from BetJamaica so I am going to stick it out until they tell me what to do here.

[SBR_John]

TBlues,
First of off no, sportsbooks will not be helping players open bank accounts.

We will try to get a list of offshore bank accounts and even try to open some accounts so we can review the process and report all that's involved.

This is what I remember:

2 copies of your passport
2 recent utility bills with your name on it
1 letter of good standing from your current bank
1 color ID of drivers license
1 bank application

Then you Fed Ex this package to the bank. They will create an account number and then you simply wire money to that account.

If anyone knows of an offshore bank that does not require you to open an account in person or through an agent please let me know. We will review their sign up process and do a background check on them and check their SnP rating and report back.

[Scorpion]

wsex, olympic, cris, and pinnacle should join hands and start a bank in antigua. issue their own atm cards,....

[tblues2005]

TBlues,
First of off no, sportsbooks will not be helping players open bank accounts.

We will try to get a list of offshore bank accounts and even try to open some accounts so we can review the process and report all that's involved.

This is what I remember:

2 copies of your passport
2 recent utility bills with your name on it
1 letter of good standing from your current bank
1 color ID of drivers license
1 bank application

Then you Fed Ex this package to the bank. They will create an account number and then you simply wire money to that account.

If anyone knows of an offshore bank that does not require you to open an account in person or through an agent please let me know. We will review their sign up process and do a background check on them and check their SnP rating and report back.

Thanks SBRJohn about this information. I didn't know you needed that much stuff. I was looking at some banks in Jamaica that will open up to someone in the USA, but it didn't give me details of it, I could send an email to them and ask them what are their requirements and I will get back with you on this. I have a good friend that is from Jamaica and I will even ask him about it also.

I would not be surprised if the books expecially the ones that are in the Carribean will team up with books though and open up accounts to wire to as a person to person transfer probably. I think they got something up their sleeve and have plan "B" in action already. After this is said and done within a few years and the Democrats here get in which I think is very possible now with all the scandals going on, then there will be laws like in England and Australia passed on gaming and make it legal as a state to state issue to gamble on the internet, expecially with all the poker players teaming up together which is getting bigger and bigger as we speak. This is a very long ways from being over I think.

[pags11]

I've just read this is a pretty complicated task...

[jjgold]

Pags yes it is and most players are not going to go through the hassles of this. I can assure you wire transfers at offshore banks are very very expensive and will turn off most players unless your betting big numbers which is not the case for most.

[SBR_John]

Its really not that difficult. We will try to do a section on this with some good info. I think the bigger draw back is the fees these places charge. Like the Provident bank if memory serves charges $75 for a wire and I don't believe they even offer paper checks.

Banking outside of the US takes some getting used to. Its slow and costly. However, its also nice to have a little money out of the reach of over zealous governments.

[Scorpion]

Its really not that difficult. We will try to do a section on this with some good info. I think the bigger draw back is the fees these places charge. Like the Provident bank if memory serves charges $75 for a bank wire and I don't believe they even offer paper checks.

.

If you have 2-3 high limit ************ from foreign banks then you can deposit to book by those CCs and withdraw by wire then you dont pay $75 because some books offer free bank wires

[jjgold]

Scorpy you got to make sure those offshore bank accounts ************ do not use American Processors as some do.

I would think the UK Solo Cards and other Euro Debit and ************ will work fine but you have to go there and get things started.

Your best bet is too fly to Canada or the UK and open up some bank accounts and make sure they have online banking options and then do everything online

[Scorpion]

I understand.

I never used CCs to fund my accounts so I really dont know much