[acw]

Of course he was scalping ... as Slash and Mudcat have mentioned, it's very easy to recognize, with about 99% certainty ...

Then I belong to the 1% of players that has this playing style too and does not make one single scalp.

[Ganchrow]

Ok, I have finished reconsidering.

BOS should be downgraded. This is clearly theft.

As mentioned, it matters not if he was scalping but ... here on the forum, it is effectively not telling the whole truth ... decieving us if you will .... so it does diminish sympathy IMHO.

The way I look at it is it's really none of my business what bets he was making. Personally, I don't thnk he'd be under any more obligation to tell us he was scalping than he would be to inform us he was betting only Shea Staudium unders.

[ourbet]

Ok, I have finished reconsidering.

BOS should be downgraded. This is clearly theft.

As mentioned, it matters not if he was scalping but ... here on the forum, it is effectively not telling the whole truth ... decieving us if you will .... so it does diminish sympathy IMHO.

I totally agree with natrass, this is appalling conduct period and (IMHO) BetonSports (group of companies) should be downgraded without further delay.

[Illusion]

BetOnSports (SBR rating C-) player reports 2nd case of funds confiscation.
The bettor lost $23,000 to the sportsbook since May 12th before his last deposit on Thursday of $4,000. The player claims the clerk offered him a 30% bonus if he would be willing to double his usual deposit of $2,000 to $4000 which he did. The bettor went on to win $20,984.87. On Saturday the account was frozen; the sportsbook telling him he was suspected of being part of a "syndicate." Today, $15,600 was sent to his Neteller account, $5,384 less than his balance. The player also holds accounts at BetOnSports Plc sites, MVP Sportsbook (SBR rating C-) and Millennium (SBR rating C-) where he has lost $8900 combined.

[hanco21]

BetOnSports (SBR rating C-) player reports 2nd case of funds confiscation.
The bettor lost $23,000 to the sportsbook since May 12th before his last deposit on Thursday of $4,000. The player claims the clerk offered him a 30% bonus if he would be willing to double his usual deposit of $2,000 to $4000 which he did. The bettor went on to win $20,984.87. On Saturday the account was frozen; the sportsbook telling him he was suspected of being part of a "syndicate." Today, $15,600 was sent to his Neteller account, $5,384 less than his balance. The player also holds accounts at BetOnSports Plc sites, MVP Sportsbook (SBR rating C-) and Millennium (SBR rating C-) where he has lost $8900 combined.

I know this is going to sound dumb but what is a "syndicate".

Thanks in advance.

[goldengoat]

betonsports = trash

[tacomax]

I know this is going to sound dumb but what is a "syndicate".

It's what BoS accuses you of being a part of when you want to make a sizeable withdrawal and they don't want to pay you.

[SBR_John]

I hate to jump the verdict but we are now aware of multiple victims coming forward of the same scam.

[JoshW]

BOS saying they will let the case go to the IBAS for arbitration. That would be good news if this organization is anything but fair. Since BOS rules are so open ended is almost impossible that they will rule in players. I have seen many cases were European books use them, and have never seen a very fair ruling.

[bigboydan]

Wonder if their stock will tank over this ?

i highly doubt it doug.

this book is just like the insurance companies here in the states. only difference is between the two are the watchdogs sites are the closest thing we have to a court verdict, and from the looks of it, it's not always a promissing ending.

[SBR_John]

As players discover that they are cheats and more and more websites publicize their scams I believe it will have an effect on their business. We have to inform players of what is going on here.

[natrass]

BOS saying they will let the case go to the IBAS for arbitration. That would be good news if this organization is anything but fair. Since BOS rules are so open ended is almost impossible that they will rule in players. I have seen many cases were European books use them, and have never seen a very fair ruling.

Are they rigistered in the UK. if so, then IBAS are very weak. However, they are still answerable to the law in the UK. The new 2006 gambling laws may make them responsible (I dont know ... maybe taco does?) but even such a tangental issue as false advertising or fraudulent activity can be a criminal offence.

Interesting stuff.

Oh, and Halifax, it does matter. If a guy says "Im just a small time player" or not is besides the point as far as the bookie is concerned I agree. The problem is it is decieving US .. also known as lying.

As you will no doubt know, I am a VERY ethical person. Fair in my dealings but very harsh on people who deieve for no interest other than their own.

[Chuck Sims]

As players discover that they are cheats and more and more websites publicize their scams I believe it will have an effect on their business. We have to inform players of what is going on here.

John, you can start by downgrading this criminal enterprise even furthur. People in the know have long known that they have used this modus operandi of scamming their customers since they first opened their doors. EOG, The RX, MajorWager, and TOW are all being paid off. You can take a stand. Downgrade these bums to a well deserved F.

Even BetRoyal and BetUS has worked with websites to get players paid that they unjustly took away from players. BOS has shown that they have no intention of returning stolen money. You can be now be in the forefront of watchdogs by putting these theives in their place.

[Terris]

You can be now be in the forefront of watchdogs by putting these theives in their place.

SBR is alrdy the only watchdog you can trust.
Those other sites are fun from time to time, but i would never give a shit about their advertisers etc.

I dont think they should be an F atm, D- is what other books that pull such shit get. I would not overreact, if they continue to steal money thou the F might be coming.

[Chuck Sims]

Terris, the reason BetOnSports does not fear scamming a forum poster is that we represent a tiny fraction of their customer base. If we only knew how many people they are scamming from the huge base of customers that do not know these forums exist.

[SBR_John]

John, you can start by downgrading this criminal enterprise even furthur. People in the know have long known that they have used this modus operandi of scamming their customers since they first opened their doors. EOG, The RX, MajorWager, and TOW are all being paid off. You can take a stand. Downgrade these bums to a well deserved F.
-Chuck Sims

Bill and I hammered out a consensus at D for now. There are still a lot of questions. An F grade is reserved for scams and books on the brink of failure. I guess a case could be made that BOS has returned to scam status. Let's see how the week goes.

[Art]

Ok, I am attaching a little time line to clear up things for the few people who still seem confused about the details of what happened.

May 21: Signup and initial deposit at Millenium

May 21 - May 25: I made 4 times $2,000 deposits

May 30: Signup and initial deposit at BOS

May 30: Placed my first BOS wager on the Toronto Bluejays at +135. The BOS line manager wanted to take only $5,000 becuase I was a new player, but then after seeing that the line didn't move while I was on the phone with him, said this is not a steam move, so he will take the wager.

May 31: Placed 1 $10,000 wager (as 2 $5,000 online bets, as customer service told me to do) at BOS - even money on the Indians. The acct was immediately limited to $1000 per wager.

May 31 - Jun 1: deposited 4 more times $3,000 at Millenium, with no problems from wagering and with customer service offering me bonuses to come back.

Jun 4: I deposited $3,000 and lost. I then deposited $3,000 again and was given a 40% cash bonus. Millenium listed the LAA at +165. I wanted to wager on them and when I tried the wager, they changed the line to +160. I took the wager anyway and finally won a wager, bringing my account balance to $10,920.

Jun 5: I attempted my second wager at Millenium (since the last deposit) on the Dodgers at +135. The bet was not accepted, and instead my acct was closed. My balance remained at $10,920. Millenium never "warned" me of anything, never mentioned steam, never mentioned anything except come back and deposit. NEVER ONCE did anyone at Millenium tell me anything about any of my wagers EVER.

Jun 7: Millenium locked my account and returned only $6,414 to my Neteller, keeping for themselves the remaining $4,506 that is in my account.

Jun 13: Millenium sends me $1,194 without explanation. They were either planning to steal this money for the last week and saw they couldn't get away with it, or else they just have no idea what they are doing and badly misalculated the basic wager I placed. 3,312 remains stolen from my account.

(These are the Neteller transactions, in case it helps)
6/4/2006 18:06 Millennium $3,000.00 - USD Accepted
6/4/2006 12:29 Millennium $3,000.00 - USD Accepted
6/1/2006 17:39 Millennium $3,000.00 - USD Accepted
6/1/2006 11:13 Millennium $3,000.00 - USD Accepted
5/31/2006 18:27 Millennium $3,000.00 - USD Accepted
5/31/2006 9:22 Millennium $3,000.00 - USD Accepted
5/30/2006 14:19 BETonSPORTS $6,000.00 - USD Accepted
5/25/2006 11:43 Millennium $2,000.00 - USD Accepted
5/24/2006 18:58 Millennium $2,000.00 - USD Accepted
5/21/2006 15:41 Millennium $2,000.00 - USD Accepted
5/21/2006 12:01 Millennium $2,000.00 - USD Accepted

[Chuck Sims]

Art, the only people that are "confused" are the BOS shills who have a stake on how BOS is perceived on the gambling forums.

EOG is one big joke. Its comical the way the owner promotes BetOnSports. When he was the former owner at The RX he was forced to take their banner down due to them robbing RX posters. Fast forward a couple of years, he starts a new site called EOG and announces to everyone that stiff books will not be allowed to advertise at his site. He specifically names BetOnSPorts as one stiff book that would never advertise at his site. He also stated that if any of his advertised books stiffed anyone he would immediately remove their banner. Are you laughing yet?

[natrass]

Art, the only people that are "confused" are the BOS shills who have a stake on how BOS is perceived on the gambling forums.

Not true. People often want ALL the facts before making a noise. Quite reasonable Id have thought.

[tacomax]

Yes, natrass, but this is Chuck Sims. If a random poster accused BoS of orchestrating the Holocaust then good ol' Chuck would swallow it like a porn star.

He'll be back in a bit to tell us (yet again) about the story of the Vegas sharp who told him 6 years ago that BoS are crooks.

[jason]

Thanks, Art. Not that it needed further clarification, but I think this makes things transaprent.

Bill, are these guys now saying that they're just gonna take the money and run, period?

[natrass]

He'll be back in a bit to tell us (yet again) about the story of the Vegas sharp who told him 6 years ago that BoS are crooks.

[Doug]

i highly doubt it doug.

this book is just like the insurance companies here in the states. only difference is between the two are the watchdogs sites are the closest thing we have to a court verdict, and from the looks of it, it's not always a promissing ending.

The stock ain't doing too great. I believe it was around 144 on Fri, it's about 132 now, so that's around 9% loss in less than a week.

[Bill Dozer]

Thanks, Art. Not that it needed further clarification, but I think this makes things transaprent.

Bill, are these guys now saying that they're just gonna take the money and run, period?

BOS is suggesting they have found more information but can't say what it is because of privacy.

The privacy excuse is a cop out. The players have begged for the details of the "violations" and authorized all of us to view it. I was CCed on the email to all BOS Mgt. from 2 of the 3 players. If they do submit their case to BOS' third party, they lack the information to even make a case for themselves.

BOS examined the issue (and previous issues) with me when they thought they had a case. Now that the world has come down on them they have new top secret info. The players are waiting for it.

BOS will be asked again, by the players and SBR, for the details of their offending actions.

[SBR_John]

With football approaching BOS could ruin the industry with these confiscations. The press and goverment eat these stories up.

[hanco21]

Had to admit this post bothered me a great deal, I had $1000 in Betonsports account and requested a withdrawal yesterday and was relieved when I found 1K in my neteller account this afternoon. I thought for sure after reading this my funds were gone. Now I am free and clear of these guys. Whew!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Chuck Sims]

tacomax and natrass, are you stooges part of the scam? The player is being robbed. What don't you understand? Still confused after Artie tells the exact same story for the 10th time while BetOnSports changes their story on a daily basis.

[tacomax]

tacomax and natrass, are you stooges part of the scam? The player is being robbed. What don't you understand? Still confused after Artie tells the exact same story for the 10th time while BetOnSports changes their story on a daily basis.

No, I'm no stooge. I just tire of the hearing the same old tosh over and over again. If you want to continue your unrelenting tirade against BoS or BetRoyal or whoever then that's fine - but please come up with some new material. That includes refraining repeating the advice that you got from the Vegas sharp 6 years ago.

[pavyracer]

Still waiting for Art's email...

Thanks,
Ken

You see he signs his posts as Ken all the time. This is for the people who said his last post at EOG was not his because he signed it as Ken and not The Shrink.

[statnerds]

wow pavy, that was some work to dig up a near 4 year old thread to support your position.

impressed i am.