[CrazyHorse]

I think I remember reading a thread a while back where someone said when you deposit by NETeller, the book doesn't actually get 100% of your funds upfront but only a percentage. Then they get the rest in installments over a month or two or something. Anyone know if this is true? DOes the book get the whole amount from NETeller right away or do they have to wait?

[tacomax]

Never heard of that one before. A nice little earner for Neteller if that's the truth, they make a mint through the fees as it is.

[natrass]

Neteller are a complete rip off.

FACT.

[tacomax]

Personally I find them excellent value.

[Mudcat]

I love Neteller. They must have different rules for Europeans for Natrass to be calling them a rip off.

My assessment would be more along the lines of: amazed at how easy it makes my life while costing so little.

However, getting to the original question: I don't know the answer. That's the first I ever heard something like that. That sure doesn't sound right.

[natrass]

Personally I find them excellent value.

Hahaha !!

3.9% fee for uploading, 2.9% charge on top if you change currency PLUS possibly the worst exchange rates used by any major institution. PLUS terrible CS.

I have read comments from maybe hundreds even thousands of people on forums who use neteller for GBP and US$ transactions. You are the only one who has ever called them "excellent value".

Either you are extremely easily pleased (to the point of ignorance) or you are just trying to argue for the sake of it (again ... yawn ).

[tacomax]

Hahaha !!

3.9% fee for uploading, 2.9% charge on top if you change currency PLUS possibly the worst exchange rates used by any major institution. PLUS terrible CS.

I'm guessing the 3.9% fee is when you first upload by CC, right? If you go to Barclays Bank, you can deposit straight to Neteller and cut out the 3.9% fee.

I've only ever deposited once into Neteller and I was charged the 3.9% (before the days when they had the Barclays option) but I'm more than willing to absorb that cost as a one-off hit.

The changing currency - well, if you sign up to the correct currency in the first place, it'll never be an issue.

I have read comments from maybe hundreds even thousands of people on forums who use neteller for GBP and US$ transactions. You are the only one who has ever called them "excellent value".

When you interchange your account by using a £ account for $ transactions then the costs do add up. I really wouldn't blame Neteller for that - they'll provide you with that service, but they charge you for it. If you are frequently making a large number of $/£ transactions then a $ bank account would be a better option.

Combine that with the fact that they are listed on the stock exchange and regulated by the FSA, I'm more than happy to have my money in there.

Either you are extremely easily pleased (to the point of ignorance) or you are just trying to argue for the sake of it (again ... yawn ).

I never argue for the sake of arguing. I just think that Neteller is excellent value. They charge a lot in fees but the sportsbooks take the hit for me on that score so there are no complaints from me.

Seriously, if you can find a better value alternative then I'll be real please to hear about it.

[nikosgr]

They have a 3.9% fee for deposits made via cc.There is no fee for neteller if you deposit via wire, but your bank will issue a (small fee).
My last deposit via wire was 1999 euros, and finally, there were 1991 euros in my account.Thats a 0.4% fee.Extremely low for me.
The exchange rates that they use are the same you can find in OANDA.Probably many ppl is arbing with currencies there, so you know OANDA.
In any case those fees are extremely low if you take under concideration that depositing to books via neteller, offers at least a 20% reload bonus.
I like Neteller.

[natrass]

Seriously, if you can find a better value alternative then I'll be real please to hear about it.

Taco .. lets compare with (say) moneybookers ...

1. Upload fees. Neteller 3.9%, moneybookers 2.5%.

2. Currency exchange surcharge. Neteller 2.9%. Moneybookers 0%.

3. Exchange rates used. Neteller factor in an extra 1.9% 'charge' for any 'currency swings' (thats what their CS told me anyway ... but they are so incompetent and confused themselves by all their charges that I wouldnt bank on it ... either way, the rate they do use can be guarranteed to be a very poor one). Moneybookers - no such charge.

So, does that make it a "better value alternative"? Not hard to find really.

But, that said, i didnt know about the barclays option (Im in barclays anyway) ... good tip.

[BuddyBear]

neteller is the best plain and simple....very professional service, very discreet about funds to and from checking accounts, and relatively quick. Can't ask much more from neteller

[tacomax]

[QUOTE=natrass]Taco .. lets compare with (say) moneybookers ...

1. Upload fees. Neteller 3.9%, moneybookers 2.5%.

2. Currency exchange surcharge. Neteller 2.9%. Moneybookers 0%.

3. Exchange rates used. Neteller factor in an extra 1.9% 'charge' for any 'currency swings' (thats what their CS told me anyway ... but they are so incompetent and confused themselves by all their charges that I wouldnt bank on it ... either way, the rate they do use can be guarranteed to be a very poor one). Moneybookers - no such charge.

So, does that make it a "better value alternative"? Not hard to find really.

Natrass, You're confusing the concepts of cost and value.

Say there are two suits for sale. They look pretty much the same and Suit A costs £50 and Suit B costs £100. Suit A will perform perfectly as a suit. Suit B will perferm perfectly as a suit but will also get me laid every time I wear it and every 10th time I wear it, I'll win on the lottery. So you see, Suit A is lower cost but Suit B is higher value.

I'll take your point about the fees and take them as read because, aside from the CC loading, I've never had to pay any fees and I won't in the future. So, for me at least, Neteller is totally fee-free.

However, aside from the fees, with Neteller:

* I get access to just about every sportsbook out there

* I get deposit bonuses at any number of sportsbooks

* I get free withdrawals at a number of sportsbooks

Using another means of payment I may not have such a wide access, I may not always get a deposit bonus and I may not always get a free withdrawl. Like I said before - don't concentrate on the cost, concentrate on the value.

[pjesnik24]

pointbet does not accept neteller and that is for me the biggest reason why I prefer moneybookers. also, if you ever decide to transfer some money to a friend then neteller just costs too much. You do not even notice the fees moneybookers take from you, so, if moneybookers is making nice money then I can only dream of how much neteller earns every single hour!

[natrass]

[QUOTE=tacomax]

Taco .. lets compare with (say) moneybookers ...

1. Upload fees. Neteller 3.9%, moneybookers 2.5%.

2. Currency exchange surcharge. Neteller 2.9%. Moneybookers 0%.

3. Exchange rates used. Neteller factor in an extra 1.9% 'charge' for any 'currency swings' (thats what their CS told me anyway ... but they are so incompetent and confused themselves by all their charges that I wouldnt bank on it ... either way, the rate they do use can be guarranteed to be a very poor one). Moneybookers - no such charge.



Natrass, You're confusing the concepts of cost and value.

Say there are two suits for sale. They look pretty much the same and Suit A costs £50 and Suit B costs £100. Suit A will perform perfectly as a suit. Suit B will perferm perfectly as a suit but will also get me laid every time I wear it and every 10th time I wear it, I'll win on the lottery. So you see, Suit A is lower cost but Suit B is higher value.

I'll take your point about the fees and take them as read because, aside from the CC loading, I've never had to pay any fees and I won't in the future. So, for me at least, Neteller is totally fee-free.

However, aside from the fees, with Neteller:

* I get access to just about every sportsbook out there

* I get deposit bonuses at any number of sportsbooks

* I get free withdrawals at a number of sportsbooks

Using another means of payment I may not have such a wide access, I may not always get a deposit bonus and I may not always get a free withdrawl. Like I said before - don't concentrate on the cost, concentrate on the value.

Fair enough. But, of course, the benefits you list are coming from the sportsbooks not neteller.

The drawback of using anything else except neteller is that a lot of US books wont take them. That is probably the only reason why a UK citizen would use neteller and not moneybookers if he was looking for value.

Sorry for the rant taco ... but I really do think they take the piss. Their website does not tell you anything about the charges you will incur. I contacted their CS through live chat and it went on for like 45 minutes ... basically, it was :

Me : Can i ask how much GBP I would get per $100 transferred back to my UK bank account?
CS : The exchange rates change every day
Me ; Say, today, what would I get?
*****10 minutes of faffing until it was finally agreed that rates change frequently but I only want to know todays as an example****
CS : 56.01p to the dollar
Me : Can I ask what exhange rate is used in that (ie except charges)?
CS : The exchange rate used was 54.07
Me : That cant be right
CS : Yes, I made a mistake
Me : So what is it then?
****endless faffing where the guy chops and changes and then basically says he doesnt know and cant find out****

But, to be fair, using a GBP DC can cost a lot as well ... so, OK, maybe Im being a bit harsh .... I'll admit that .. but they are expensive.

You should give moneybookers a go as they are getting more popular.

[tacomax]

The drawback of using anything else except neteller is that a lot of US books wont take them. That is probably the only reason why a UK citizen would use neteller and not moneybookers if he was looking for value.

You've hit the nail on the head.

You should give moneybookers a go as they are getting more popular.

In the unlikely event that Moneybookers becomes as universally accepted as Neteller then I might consider it, but even then I probably won't. Since I'm dealing in a currency other than my domestic one do I really want a stash of $s in Neteller and a stash of $s in Moneybookers? I'd much rather have all my $s in one place.

[natrass]

Yes, but just because they are widely accepted does not make them excellent value does it?

They can often be the only viable method to use some US bookies but it still is like they are taking a hefty cut ... when (aspjesnik24 said) moneybookers shows that these charges dont reflect any cost based reality but are simply profiteering from their position ... i.e. because they can.

Can i ask ... so you have all this money in $ ... do you never make any withdrawals? I am just wondering how you arent being hit by their "excellent value" conversions (unless you have your own non-neteller methods, of course, which is your own personal business)

[tacomax]

Yes, but just because they are widely accepted does not make them excellent value does it?

No it doesn't, but for me one of the reasons why Neteller is excellent value is it's level of acceptance. Remember, I originally said that "personally I find them excellent value" - I didn't proclaim them to be the best for everyone nor the cheapest in terms of fees.

They can often be the only viable method to use some US bookies but it still is like they are taking a hefty cut ... when (aspjesnik24 said) moneybookers shows that these charges dont reflect any cost based reality but are simply profiteering from their position ... i.e. because they can.

Companies everywhere do that every minute of the day. If you're smart then you'll find ways around obstacles which are thrown at you.

For example, if you're driving on a long journey you could:

a) Buy some petrol from the motorway service station and then moan about how they've added an extra 10 pence per litre of fuel.

b) Make sure the car is sufficiently filled up with fuel before you set off.

Can i ask ... so you have all this money in $ ... do you never make any withdrawals? I am just wondering how you arent being hit by their "excellent value" conversions (unless you have your own non-neteller methods, of course, which is your own personal business)

I'll withdraw when there's a million there.

But seriously, when I want to withdraw then I'll tell them to wire the money to a $ account I have. That way I'll take responsibility for any exchange rate costs myself and I'll be hit with no fees.

[CrazyHorse]

Can US users use moneybookers?

An important thing to remember is that even if books eat the NETeller fees for you, it's still costing you, just indirectly. If NETeller charged lower fees, the books would make more and would offer bigger bonuses to stay competitive. So really you are losing out when there are high fees, regardless of who pays them (you or the book).

If no one has ever heard of my original question, maybe I misread something, or maybe someone misspoke, it does seem unusual. I could have sworn I read that though.

[Catsfan]

I can't speak for people outside of the U.S. but for Americans you can't beat Neteller. I have never paid a penny for any fees dealing with Neteller. I only deal with books that cover the fees. If I need to transfer money from my bank to my Neteller account there is no charge. It takes 3 or 4 days but there is no charge. I prefer to make a withdrawl from a book to my Neteller account and leave it in there so when I need to make a deposit I can send the money instantly and never pay any fees. It does not get any better than that.

[pags11]

neteller's always treated me right...I never get charged to transfer funds...granted I usually withdraw via the EFT method (takes about two days)...usually I deposit funds via the EFT method at the beginning of football season (takes about five days), or I do instacash with books that cover the fees...they are absolutely fantastic...I get paid faster online now than I ever did at regular sportsbooks...

[isetcap]

Natrass is correct on this issue. Neteller is a dismal product if you were actually classify it as a financial institution. If anyone thinks they are player-friendly, they are deceived. Neteller exists for the merchants, not the players. I'd be more than happy to pay more for a true banking service that does not profile its customer base and pass along that information to its merchants. Simply because they do things "quickly" and with minimal fees does not mean they are a great service.

[JoshW]

Neteller isn't perfect, but for a US players who moves money around frequently is tough to beat. For a player who sends money to and from the US to the Neteller account the fees may add up, but for someone who keeps most of his gambling money offershore I like it. Are they making a fortune off of us via merchants and some players fees, yes. But when 99% of US focused books take Neteller, gives them a big edge.

I can't disagree with any of the points against Neteller or for Moneybookers, but is all a matter of how you use the service.

[CrazyHorse]

I'd be more than happy to pay more for a true banking service that does not profile its customer base and pass along that information to its merchants.

You're saying NETeller does this?

[MetraDynamix]

I love Net Teller for the ATM Card. I never had any real issues with them. I would not recommend using *******, as their service is definitely inferior to Net Teller. Definitely will agree that the fees are slightly inflated, but these companies must also make money I presume.

[slacker00]

You're saying NETeller does this?

I'd like more info also. I've never heard about Neteller selling infomation about me to 3rd parties. I'd be very interested in the evidence if this is indeed the case.

As for Natrass, I'm in the U.S. and I've never paid a fee to Neteller and I've done 100's of transactions. I can only imagine that the merchant is picking up the tab.

[isetcap]

I'd like more info also. I've never heard about Neteller selling infomation about me to 3rd parties. I'd be very interested in the evidence if this is indeed the case.

As for Natrass, I'm in the U.S. and I've never paid a fee to Neteller and I've done 100's of transactions. I can only imagine that the merchant is picking up the tab.

I never said Neteller "sells" the information to 3rd parties. They may or may not do that. They do, in fact, profile your location and activity in such as manner as to be beneficial to the online gambling institutions. Their functionality is, in fact, essentially spyware. They are, in fact, more than happy to freely pass around any IP data they gather on you.

I can certainly understand the opinion of anyone who thinks Neteller is "as good as it gets", but that is only because good options have yet to come along for us. I remember a time when large percentages of people used to think that AOL dial-up was "as good as it gets".

[slacker00]

Thanks for the explanation isetcap. I agree with you about the AOL analogy. I hope competition gets to the point that Neteller is considered "average", because that will mean that there are some kickass alternatives out there. Hell, competition might get to the point that they might start offering me interest on my money. lol

P.S. AOL is absolutely "the suck" and I weep for anyone using them in these days. I used them via their free trial for a short while and they kept charging my CC all kinds of random charges for my "free trial". I went through my CC company and got the charges reversed, but what a pain in the ass.

[pags11]

I've never seen a need for the neteller DC...they take out a monthly fee and I get paid soon enough through the EFT's...

[CrazyHorse]

I've never seen a need for the neteller DC...they take out a monthly fee and I get paid soon enough through the EFT's...

A lot of people don't like to pay taxes

[CrazyHorse]

they might start offering me interest on my money. lol

That I would love. And why not? If I'm keeping a lot of money with them, you know they're making all kinds of interest off it. Paypal, etc., give interest on money you keep there. Why doesn't any place offer this?

[isetcap]

That I would love. And why not? If I'm keeping a lot of money with them, you know they're making all kinds of interest off it. Paypal, etc., give interest on money you keep there. Why doesn't any place offer this?

Because, as I stated earlier, Neteller is not nearly as wonderful as everyone likes to think it is. While it may be considered by some the best currently available solution, it is in fact far from good.

[Mudcat]

Good thread.