[Dark Horse]

Suns are getting a lot of bad rap lately. They've been losing, and have dropped from 1 to 6 in the West fast. Is it time to write off the Suns? I don't think so. Consider:

Last night the Suns beat the Jazz by nine points until the 4Q. Nine points... Pretty f*cking good. So they're not finishing. Yet.

The Suns are playing in the very competitive West, where a lot of teams are peaking. Problem for the other teams: you can only peak so long.

Where are the Suns in the team building process? I would say they're just about to enter the third week of November. At this early stage, of course they're losing when the game goes to playoff intensity. That's what happened last night in the 4Q. But another thing that happened last night was enormous progress from the previous game against Denver.

Growth potential. Clearly, the Suns are at the top of the batch when we consider the room for growth still there at this point in the season. The West is so competitive that all the other contenders may be peaking too early. If the Suns can get it together in time, they can peak while the other teams are coming down. The door could be wide open to the NBA finals. (East has a huge edge in the NBA finals, because that team won't be nearly as exhausted).

Watch the Phoenix rise from its own ashes!

[Dark Horse]

Suns take a step forward. A strong 4Q for the win over San Antonio, 94-87.

Still a long way to go. The Suns did rebuild the team especially for the Spurs. And Spurs couldn't buy a basket: 34% for the game.

But Shaq was used much better. They should have no trouble with Memphis, so the next test is Thursday against Golden State. Ironically, the Suns have had the most trouble with high-powered offenses since the trade; losing the run and gun contests. Warriors could run Suns out of the gym, so this game will be a good measuring stick for Phoenix.

[Dark Horse]

Another good win for 'Los Suns' (name on shirt in some games!) over the running and gunning Warriors. Still not close to where they can be, but the first signs are there. Their defense had the right intensity against the Spurs, and it was good at stretches in tonight's fast paced game. There is no doubt that Shaq's brought back the spark. The bench was sharp today, and the turnovers are coming down. (Nash had the highest turnover average in his career last month!). Slowly the pieces are starting to fall into place.

The Suns are only in the first stages of team building. They didn't just add a piece, like the Lakers, but had to rebuild from ground level. That dynamic, for a top team this late in the season, is certainly fascinating, and maybe even unique, from a sports gambling perspective. If the Suns at this early stage can put away the Spurs and Warriors (each at the top in their style of play), then where could they be at playoff time? Remember that the other teams have little room for growth left. They're working on the last details, while the Suns are still sketching a basic outline. In the coming weeks I'll be watching their growth curve with great interest. Can this team, looking lost and helpless just a week ago, develop fast enough to go where they want to go?

I could see Nash figure it out in time. If anyone can orchestrate in a couple of months what would normally take a season, he can. Imagine the Suns as a well oiled machine with Amare and Shaq both rolling... Who would be able to stop them?

Long way to go until the playoffs. The Suns will need every minute of it. They're my pick. At least for the NBA story of the year.

[Dark Horse]

Suns are looking scary tonight against the Kings. Things are coming together for them FAST. Amare incredible. Giricek hot hand. If they continue this growth curve the rest of the NBA is playing for second.

Shaq is hitting his FT's too...

Halftime 79-48. A 42-14 second quarter.

Same Kings team that beat the Lakers in LA last Sunday. Suns love playing this team, so this game is not representative. Still. That was some of the best basketball I've seen in a long time. This team is complete; not finished, but complete. They have all the pieces.

[Dark Horse]

Shaq may not be neutral, but he doesn't talk bs. Today's papers:

“My first 10 games, we let six slip away … it was us committing turnovers and struggling on defense and not getting to the shooters,” O’Neal said.

"We're starting to pick up our intensity and play," O'Neal said. "The sky's the limit for this team."

"I've been on a lot of good teams," O'Neal said, "but this team actually has every piece from one to 12. It probably is the first team I've played on that has every piece one to 12."


A lot of people wrote off the Suns, because they didn't understand the NBA process of team building. This public perception has lead to some incredible prices for Suns futures. The Suns have a very tough schedule to close out the season. But that only means they're not going to relax. From hereon they have only one option: full steam ahead...

[fearless]

Great job, Dark Horse. You're using this thread as a blog, I've never seen it before. It's quite enlightening and entertaining, thanks.

[Dark Horse]

Thanks. I see almost all Suns game, so may as well.

Tonight Suns are missing an opportunity. They are not using the easy game in Seattle as a step in their continuing building process, instead falling for the trap game. They came out aggressive, took an early 12 pt lead and then ... relaxed. Very hard to turn it back up after letting the air out of the balloon. The only reason they're up by 9 pts at the half is a ridiculous 3-pt shooting percentage (11 of 13; stats show 11 of 14, but that includes a last second 1H throw from midcourt). The number that stands out is a shocker: 17 1H turnovers by the Suns. Need any clearer indication of the lack of concentration?

[Dark Horse]

Bell was shooting a deadly 6 for 6 from 3 pt land, and a sh*tty Seattle defender sticks out his foot when Raja takes a jumper. Bell lands on it and twists his ankle. In a meaningless game, except for the sure win... Could be out for a few games, which would be bad news for the Suns with Houston, Detroit, and Boston coming up in the next three games, and the West being as close as it is:

Hornets 46-21
Lakers 46-21
Houston 46-22
Utah 45-24
Suns 46-22
San Antonio 44-23
Dallas 44-24

Lakers at Utah tomorrow night.

[Dark Horse]

Suns took care of the Rockets early (38-21 1Q) and pretty much coasted the rest of the way for the 122-113 win. Progress continues, but it was only visible in the 1Q. After that Phoenix played soft on defense. The best thing to take away from this game was that they controlled the lead with ease, responding to every mini run by the Rockets. It was basically a game of cat and mouse; against the same team that had a 22 game winning streak going last week, second highest in NBA history. The next two games will gave a good indication of where the Suns stand. On the road against Detroit and Boston. Definitely still room for improvement. Still too many turnovers (16), and giving up too many easy baskets. Rockets grabbed 15 offensive rebounds.

Of one thing I'm quite sure right now. This Suns team is better than last year's.

PS - Shaq is making his FT's.

[Dark Horse]

The Suns played well in stretches tonight. Strangely, their worst part of the game came against the Pistons bench. In a game that was close throughout Detroit's reserves seemed to have forced the decision. But when the Pistons starters came back with a 8 pt lead in the 4Q Phoenix wiped out that lead in no time. What a dominance! The Suns took the lead and had all the momentum until, with 2 minutes left and a five pt lead, the zebras decided differently. May numbers 45, 65 and 38 one day join Donaghy behind bars.

The Suns progress continues. A zebra-enforced OT loss in Detroit is acceptable at this point. They still allowed too many offensive rebounds and too many uncontested shots. And Grant Hill missed two -out of two- crucial FT's down the stretch; pretty shaky nerves for a 87 percent FT shooter... And as mentioned they fell asleep against the Piston's bench. Unacceptable lack of focus.

On offense things are coming together nicely. I think Amare is now the best offensive player in the league. Him and Shaq are a devastating tandem on the floor. This team will go deep into the playoffs. They're already better than last year and not close to a finished product. Unfortunately, tonight reminded me that whoever lifts the trophy in the end may not be up to the players.

[Dark Horse]

Much of the playoffs is about match-ups. Just ask Dallas. The two teams the Suns don't match up well with are the Hornets in the West and the Pistons in the East. Everybody else is in their cross hair. Lakers and Suns should take it to seven. The Suns have a greater variety of players than the Lakers, so more options in a long series. Exhaustion could be a problem for the Western team in the NBA finals, so D'Antoni can't afford not to play his bench. Will he develop his bench during this close playoff race? He has to, but he isn't inclined to...

Getting too far ahead. Celtics are next.

[Dark Horse]

It was bad out there, last night in zebra land:

Paul Coro
The Arizona Republic
Mar. 24, 2008 07:26 PM
AUBURN HILLS, Mich. - The Suns have had excruciatingly close losses and frustratingly bad ones. They have been embarrassingly overwhelmed and knowingly outworked.

But not once all season had the Suns been as angry after a loss as they were following Monday night's 110-105 overtime defeat against Detroit at the Palace of Auburn Hills. They headed for Boston feeling good about the way they scored and defended against a powerhouse team despite having a seven-game win streak end.

They just felt outmanned.

"We played well enough to win," Suns forward Grant Hill said. "It's just hard five against eight."

The Suns could find fault with themselves for losing a 94-89 lead with 2:40 to go in regulation, with one Detroit offensive rebound providing a late Rasheed Wallace 3-pointer and another denying them a chance at a winning shot. But it was hard for them to focus on those plays or the missed shots down the stretch of overtime when they were so furious with the officiating.

"We had our chances to win," Suns guard Steve Nash said. "We didn't get the calls."

Suns video coordinator Noel Gillespie was the most popular man in the postgame locker room, because players wanted to look at the calls that had them seething after Detroit had scored the game's final six points. Two particular calls raised their ire.

With the Suns leading 94-92 after Wallace's 3-pointer off a Rodney Stuckey rebound, Shaquille O'Neal missed inside when he was hit across the face by Antonio McDyess and slapped across the left arm by Stuckey with no call. McDyess said after the game that he was fouling in hack-a-Shaq mode.

"I wish they wouldn't have had help," O'Neal said of the Pistons. "I sure wish those people (officials Joe Forte, Michael Smith and Sean Wright) would get a little more consistent in how they call a game. I know I got fouled down there. It ain't no all ball. (Expletive) that. I know I got fouled, and there's a ref standing there. He should have (expletive) called it. I got chopped in the head. He should have (expletive) called it. Period.

"It'd been a different game if they'd done what they're supposed to do. They had help."

A blocking foul on Nash for a Chauncey Billups' 3-point play with 1:01 to go also had Phoenix fired up. The Suns led 105-104 when Nash tried to take a charge on Billups' drive. Billups converted for a 107-105 lead. Nash missed a jumper to tie the score, and O'Neal was called for a foul on the rebound, setting up two McDyess free throws that made the lead 109-105 with 45.9 seconds to go. Wallace blocked an Amaré Stoudemire fadeaway on the next play.

"We got hosed down the stretch," Hill said. "It was just bad. Rasheed's agreeing with you about the foul situation. Then you know you got screwed."

The Suns still came a long way from the team that lost to Detroit by 30 in Phoenix on Feb. 24, when O'Neal was in his third game with the Suns.

They were outrebounded for just the third time in O'Neal's 17-game Suns career. The 16 second-chance Pistons points hurt as well as 16 Suns turnovers for 20 Pistons points.

Stoudemire led Phoenix with 33 points, including 15 on free throws, but Billups countered with his own 15 free throws to finish with 32 points.

"It's not a really bad loss," Nash said. "Everyone's disappointed and angry. We felt like we played well enough to win and feel like, in some ways, it was taken from us."

[diogee]

Excellent read in here Dark Horse...very nice work

[Dark Horse]

Thanks. Just curious to see where this is going.

[diogee]

Same here

[CrazyLou]

Happens more than some people realize, zebras angle games all the time be it because of personal, financial, or other reasoning.

[Wyndham]

Horribly one-sided game last night indeed. That was some pathetic home-cooking.

[Dark Horse]

I only saw the 1H of the Celtics game.

Doc Rivers had a good game plan and the Celtics came out hammering on the Sun's defensive weaknesses in the 1Q. In the 2Q the Suns showed off their offensive genius. A tale of two quarters. The score was tied at 57 at halftime, but the Suns had been shooting 67%, which didn't bode too well for the 2H. Sure enough, they were blown out.

The point of this thread is to see how the Sun's 'work in progress' is going. I believe the Celtics may have done the Suns a big favor, by showing them what they still need to work on.

The Suns know how good they can be, but they may have gotten ahead of themselves by believing they were closer to the finished product than they really are. They need to understand the urgency of working on their weak points. There isn't much time left until the playoffs. Rebounding, much improved with Shaq, has been terrible in the last two games. They gave up 17 offensive rebounds against Boston. That suggests they have mentally relaxed (somewhat understandable after 7 straight wins). And it is no longer acceptable to have this many turnovers (21 tonight).

So as ugly as it probably was, -I didn't see the 2H-, this is exactly what the Suns needed. The first two quarters showed the difference between a team playing without and with urgency: -13 pts and +13 pts.

Probably their preparation was disturbed by an inability to forget the Detroit game. I say that because Nash took a charge in the 1H, and was furious that he didn't get the call, to the point of getting a technical. His uncharacteristic reaction suggested that he immediately went back in his mind to the missed call at the end of regulation in Detroit. Long story short: the team may have been sidetracked, but it can't afford to be sidetracked. The Suns needed a month to adjust to Shaq, and that is understandable. But it is not acceptable that they played soft against Boston.

In the NBA you need the ability to forget. And forget quickly. Dallas is the prime example of what happens if you let a past theme define the present. They lost to Miami in the finals when they had the title practically won, then played hard the whole next season for the best record in the league and home court advantage, but got kicked out by the Warriors in the 1st round of the playoffs. So this year the theme continued with their decision to focus primarily on the playoffs and take the regular season with a grain of salt. Result? They may now miss the playoffs all together... Compare that scenario of lingering memory to the cliche (and focus) of taking it 'one game at a time'.

There is not enough focus on the present if the mind lingers on the past. This starts with the coach. D'Antoni mentioned before the Boston game that it was hard to forget the painful loss to Detroit. He needs to take a page out of the Belichik book.

[Dark Horse]

There was a pretty funny situation in last night's game. I already mentioned the technical that Nash drew. Dick Bavetta tried to shield an angry Nash from protesting against the ref that made the (bad) call. To no avail. Apparenty, Bavetta agreed with Nash because he gave the Suns a makeup call on their next possession. Two FT's for Amare and the score was back to 'honest'. On the very next Suns possession, however, the other ref, the one that had made the call against Nash, gave the Celtics a makeup call. Again, there was no contact or anything. For a brief moment the thought flashed across my mind that he knew Bavetta had made the makeup call, and didn't appreciate being corrected like that. Did he in turn correct Bavetta at the first chance he got? A battle between refs?! How deep does the rabbit hole go? - Just wondering.

[stump]

i like the suns vs philly on friday

[Dark Horse]

With Dallas apparently on its way out of the playoff picture I wouldn't call this a must win for the Suns, but it's close.

The point to watch out for is if or when the 4th spot in the West is out of reach for the Suns. That means no home court advantage throughout the playoffs, and probably a shift towards positioning. Suns would love to meet Houston and avoid Hornets in 1st round.

[Dark Horse]

The Suns showed up today in the 1H. If they can just play like this consistently. Will be hard to keep focused with a 20+ pt lead.

[Dark Horse]

Player that looks exhausted is Grant Hill. Shows up as sloppy play. He wasn't supposed to play this many minutes when the Suns got him. Tell that to D'Antoni.

[DukeJohn]

I hope Stoudemire doesn't foul out. Man, he is close

[DukeJohn]

Originally Posted by DukeJohn

I hope Stoudemire doesn't foul out. Man, he is close

Grr... He fouled out with 5:36 left. Come on Suns, just a little longer.

[Dark Horse]

Easy win for the Suns. Not what Philly expected.
Hard to get a feel for where the Suns are right now. They haven't taken a step forward on this road trip. After a big leap to the next level a couple of weeks ago, they've reached a plateau. Do they have another leap in them?

Suns @ Nets tomorrow.

[DeluxeLiner]

Hey Dark Horse I'd like to start off by saying I love this thread on the Suns post-Shaq trade status, its great. I think the Suns are going to win by 13+ tomorrow. What would lead me to believe anything otherwise?

[Dark Horse]

Thanks. It's hard to get a read on the Suns on a day to day basis, but the potential for a big leap forward is clearly still there.

It's actually very easy for the Suns to take the next step. When they were struggling to adjust to Shaq the defense did a great job off the glass. But after they got their mojo back they've given up a ridiculous number of second chance points. The Suns gave up 22 offensive rebounds to Philly and still blew them out.

The stat that hasn't improved since Shaq's arrival is turnovers. Nash has adjusted, but other players have not.

If they improve defensive rebounding and turnovers the Suns should be able to beat anyone.

If you hadn't noticed, the number of The Beast is no longer 666. It is 1. The name is Amare. Nobody can stop him. It's f*cking street poetry what he shows on offense.

Meanwhile, dark clouds are gathering in Lakerland. As if consecutive home losses to Charlotte and Memphis weren't enough, now Fisher has a foot injury that normally takes 6 to 8 weeks of rest, that he will try to play through. He's a huge chunk of their playoff experience. Lakers still have a 1/2 game lead over the Suns, plus hold the tiebreaker in the crazy Wild West. http://www.latimes.com/sports/basket...tory?track=rss

[Dark Horse]

These Suns are like a box of chocolate. You never know what you're going to get.

Tonight they came out without ANY intensity against the Nets. Behind 17-27 early on. All the familiar mistakes. Pretty amazing when you consider how close the West is.

[Dark Horse]

Suns beat Nets by 6. A better effort off the defensive glass, still too many turnovers. Zebras once again drew way too much attention to themselves; this time by calling seven technicals.

Next up is a home and away series against Denver. The Nuggets passed Golden State tonight for the eight spot in the playoffs. With the Suns tied with the Lakers for 1st place in the division, the next two games should have playoff intensity.

[Dark Horse]

Wow. What a game! Suns came home from one week road trip, relaxed early on, and let Denver pick them apart. Halftime score: Denver 70-51. Biggest deficit 22 pts. Denver shot amazing percentage, but Suns defense soft.
Suns turned up the intensity in 2H and won the game 132-117. They won the 2H by 34 pts! One half of I-eat-you-alive playoff basketball. I get the feeling sometimes that they're looking ahead. Not to the next big game, but to the playoffs. The second half was the best half the Suns have played this season.

Tomorrow night part two in Denver. Does the progress continue? When they want to play these Suns are scary.

[Dark Horse]

Missed a few a games.

Today Suns were up 13 pts in the 4Q against Dallas and then thought they could coast to the end. Horrible attitude, horrible shooting, and horrible coaching. As usual when they have a noon game. Amare, the go-to guy with 26 pts through the first three quarters, was on the bench and didn't take his first shot in the 4Q until 5+ minutes were left. Until then, the Suns settled for jumpers, missing every single one of them. What a hack job by D'Antoni.

The only good thing? It didn't happen in the playoffs.

[t-bone]

today's 4th quarter was the worst basketball ive ever seen in my life, **** the suns!

[Dark Horse]

The strange thing is that the Suns didn't regroup. They went from total control to giving away the game without any resistance. As if they couldn't care less. Who knows. Maybe they didn't.

[Dark Horse]

Was this playoff positioning?

1) The Suns almost certainly will not overtake the Lakers. So while 'the world' sees a tight playoff race, the Suns may not see it that way.
2) After 3 quarters it must have been clear to them that they can have Dallas any time.
3) New Orleans is the team that has had the Suns number. New Orleans is in the number one playoff spot in the western conference.
4) Dallas has a much better shot at beating New Orleans than Denver has. So why not give the Mavs a little help?

[5) Some bad blood between Suns and Nuggets. After two battles between the teams last week. With Carmelo Anthony bating Raja Bell into a technical; quickly followed by another technical for Bell for smiling at the ref.]

Just a thought.

The reason I'm going there is that there was not a moment of anger among the Suns in the 4Q. Normally, if things don't go there way, they use anger to get back in it. Today, nothing.